MovieChat Forums > The Seventh Sign (1988) Discussion > Commenting on P Money's review

Commenting on P Money's review

posted 20 years ago by Phoenix_13
3 replies | jump to latest

WARNING! SPOILERS AHEAD!

Saying that Prochnow's character's motives are never quite clear shows me that P Money did not pay very close attention to this movie. Maybe I'm just obsessed, having watched this movie several times and being a huge fan of Jürgen Prochnow, but it very clearly states his "motives."

David Bannon, Prochnow's character, explains it to Abby (Demi Moore) quite clearly: (these probably aren't exact quotes, since I haven't seen the movie in years, but they're pretty close)

"I came as the Lamb; I return as the Lion."

Abby stabs David with a chef's knife

"Now, I am His Wrath."

***

"I can't die again, Abby. I wish I could." (David can't be the sacrifice this time. Someone else has to do it.)

***

"The Guf is empty." (if you've seen the movie, you'll remember what the Guf is; I've yet to research this and see if the story he tells is actually a part of Judeo-Christian mythology, although it seems to contradict the idea of God's grace being infinite. Then again, what isn't contradictory about Christianity?)

***

"I'm its witness."

==============================

David Bannon (Prochnow) is a Jesus-like figure, although his statement that "I return as the Lion" suggests to me that, in this incarnation or assumption, he is more like the Messiah of Aaron (a warlike messiah) than the Messiah of David (the Christ).

God's grace has run out, and Abby and her unborn child are the keys to the survival of the human race and the replenishment of the Guf (I've also seen it spelled "Guph").

Abby has apparently had several miscarriages, at least one of which prompted a depression so severe that she attempted suicide by slitting her wrists (the wrong way, judging by the scars). When David reveals himself to her, and it is made clear that she is the only one who can possibly save humanity, he also grasps her by the wrists, exposing the scars, and says "How can someone who cared so little for life give life to the world?"

This is also, in a sense, Abby's opportunity for redemption for a previous incarnation in which she was (apparently) Mary Magdalen -- and seemingly had the opportunity to die in Jesus' (David's) stead. This again contradicts MODERN Christianity with its suggestion of reincarnation, but actually, reincarnation was once a tenet of Christianity (officially, it hasn't been since about the 4th century Council of Nicea, but at least two references to reincarnation still exist in the Bible).

I highly recommend this movie.

[–] zombiepunkcaptain 20 years ago

Wow, SarahJane13, that was extremely informative - you definately have an indepth knowledge of this film and the bible, unlike me who is only a child of christianity. In that respect perhaps you could help me with a few questions.

I saw this movie today on subscription TV, although i had a fever of 39 degrees so was a little hazy in recalling or comprehending all of the movie

1. In the flash back of Abbie's former life, who are the character former selfs representing. I.e. Abby =, David =, Richard (?? I think that's his name ??).

2. COuld you post the seven signs for me to look at - yes i do have a bible and could do it myself, lol, but.

3, Did you find anything on "The Guf", i'm having a hard time, I've googled and yahooed it but cant find much relevant info.

Thanx, cya.

<-Isaiah 6:9->

[–] auntrollie 20 years ago

I just finished watching the movie (not for the first time!) and thought I'd check to see what people here had to say about it.

In answer to your questions,
1. Abby = possibly Mary Magdelene, or possibly just some random handmaiden who happened to be present when Cartaphilus was beating Christ.

David = Christ

Richard = Cartaphilus, a guardsman of Pilate who struck Christ and so was doomed to walk the earth until Christ returned. A link telling the story: http://www.anomaly.co.uk/frames.htm

2. According to the movie (yes, I have a bible too, but am also too lazy to actually look them up!) the signs are: (i)the oceans die (seas boil, fish die - opening scene in the movie); (ii) ice storm in the desert; (iii) rivers run with blood; (iv) moon turns to blood; (v) death of the last martyr; (vi) sun goes dark and earthquakes; (vii) death of the soulless child.

Somewhere in there there's a hailstorm in L.A. - that might go with the second sign - the ice storm in the desert. When the hailstorm happens and Abby meets the priest (Father Lucci/Father Richard Morel/Cartaphilus), he comments that the second horseman's wrath is still being felt. That seems to have direct reference to the storm that's happening there as they're speaking, and would make sense if that sign is general meteorological disturbances.

Ok, I broke down and opened up my bible. Signs: Rev 6; 1-8 is the opening of the first four seals, and that unleashes the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse - Pestilence, War, Famine, Death.
Rev6;9 is the opening of the fifth seal - the death of the last martyr.
Rev6;12 - sixth seal - earthquake, the moon became blood, the sun as sackcloth, stars fell to the earth.
Rev8;1 - seventh seal - silence in heaven (for about a half an hour!)

What follows that is Rev 8;6 - 10;11 which has seven angels who seem to do seven ~more~ signs. Blowing trumpets and making a lot of noise, so I guess there's no more silence in heaven......
(I)Rev8;7 - angel sounds his trumpet and there is hail and fire mingled with blood which burns up 1/3 of the trees and grass.
(II)Rev8;8, 9 - second angel sounds, there is a mountain burning with fire cast into the sea, and 1/3 part of the sea became blood and 1/3 of the creatures and ships in the sea died.
(III)Rev8;10, 11 - third angel sounds, a great star fell from the heavens and fell upon the rivers and turned the water bitter and many men died.
(IV)Rev8;12 - fourth angel sounds, 1/3 of the sun, moon and stars are darkened.
(V)Rev9;1 - 12 - fifth angel sounds, a star fell from heaven and opened up the bottomless pit which spewed forth smoke which darkened the sun and the air. A plague of locusts also came forth from the pit and were set to torment those without the seal of god for five months.
(VI)Rev9;13 - 21 - sixth angel sounds, calling forth four other angels to slay 1/3 of men.
Rev10;7 - When the seventh angel sounds, it will signal the end of the mastery of god.
(VII)Rev11;15 - the seventh angel sounds, there were great voices in heaven and the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our lord.

And yet that's not the end of the world....Rev 16 has seven ~more~ angels (or are they the same ones?) who open up vials and unleash the seven last plagues upon the earth. Then there's a war....it just goes on and on....

3. I googled The Guf as well, and didn't get much at all. Here's the only informative link that came up: http://mobydicks.com/bible/KingJamesBiblehall/messages/71.html

For a much lighter version of the end of the world as we know it, you should read "Good Omens: The Nice And Accurate Prophesies of Agnes Nutter, Witch" by Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett.

________________________
"The bitch hit me with a toaster!"

[–] 20 years ago

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