Did Bill consider Mr. Milich's offer? We see the blue fantasy that firmed Bill's desire to seemingly get laid, right after the Milich scene ends, and then to add to that disturbing idea, someone pointed out on an analysis website that a painting in Bill's office was used (partially, only the feet I believe) in Lolita.
He imagines Alice again in another scene in his office, then calls Marion.
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I'm not sure, he did seem pretty distraught at the fact that Mr. Milich didn't call the police. Also after the whole bizarre night when he returns to his apartment, the first thing he checks is the safety of his own daughter. So I think he was more disturbed by the offer if anything. Perhaps getting over his wife's confession of her near infidelity wasn't something that was going to leave his mind so easily.
http://www.imdb.com/list/_OaGg-zdQKo/
It's at least a possibility, given the order of events. Milich makes the offer, cut to a city street, green lights, MetLife building in the distance, Bill is pondering and returns to the blue Alice fantasy. He decides to go to Somerton instead - where oddly enough there is a letter prepared for him.
It may be that incident was a catalyst for Bill to investigate the previous night's events. And the link between some of the women he has encountered (Marion, Domino, Milich's daughter, Mandy) is becoming more clear to him - even though concern for his daughter seems to be secondary to being subservient to his masters and his ego.
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Yeah it definitely stirred everything up in him again if he was ready to go back asleep. Regarding the daughter, I read an interesting post on here about her being a sacrifice. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120663/board/nest/256929664?ref_=tt_bd_4
I don't agree with it being literally so but it raises some good points. In the film Kubrick explores our hyper sexualized society and the elites at the top who shape it to be this way playing on our fears and desires, for their own end. Kubrick used a book called Subliminal Seduction for inspiration while doing The Shining. It's a book that shows how media uses sex to attract people into buying products, among other things. Our society has become so sexualized that you can't see an ad for a soft drink or Disney cartoons without being sold sex.
Women to these secret elite cults are of the most prized things, like sacred gems. They are the centerfold of their rituals, an object of worship even. These elite satanic cults hunger for earthly dominion and pleasures and materialism...It's no wonder why this film is set during Christmas, a fabricated celebration brought about by their ideals and goals. So the women and men for that matter in this society are bred by them, they're products through influence of media and culture, to be subservient as you said to masters.
But specifically women here are the more abused and subjected to manipulation. A lot of women in this film, especially the two women Bill meets at Zeigler's party, are portrayed as zombiefied barbie dolls just selling themselves for sex, and unconsciously as the case is because they've been subconsciously manipulated to be that way. Alice is genuinely confused at the fact when she says ''So, because I'm a beautiful woman, the only reason any man wants to talk to me is because he wants to *beep* me? Is that what you're saying?''. At Ziegler's Alice was basically selling herself to Szavost although she had no intention of being unfaithful to her husband, she was just acting on impulse.
Now Helena is being bred by her mother to be the same way, as indicated by the scenes where she's dressing her, almost making her a clone of herself. And during the final scene of the film, Helena holds up a barbie doll and says ''look mommy!'', as if to say this is what I'm gonna be when I grow up.
http://www.imdb.com/list/_OaGg-zdQKo/
I agree with what you say, and I think it is an Overlooked theme to the film. Helena is linked to Domino, and Milich's daughter and even Mandy. As I've said in other threads, child abuse is a common Kubrick theme - and Kubrick is basically saying we've commodified it. There is a requiem feel to Eyes Wide Shut - a lament for the state of things. It's satirical and dark and usual Kubrick but with something different, a funereal tone - not surprising given the themes of death and obsession and what not, but also uncanny because of Kubrick's personal life and investment in the film.
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Yeah come to think of it child abuse is pretty prevalent in his films, Lolita, A Clockwork Orange, Barry Lyndon, The Shining and one could argue especially Full Metal Jacket. But sometimes these issues Kubrick explores in his films can become personal. If I may get sentimental for a bit, I was a kid in the 90's, and both my parents would work in the day and sometimes go out to parties at night while I stayed home with a sitter much like Helena. The way the society is shaped by the elite lends way to child neglect. It's like the parents don't consciously know that they're doing it but in the long run there are repercussions and has effects on the child. In my early teens I picked up smoking then before my 20's I had problems with alcohol. And all this time the parents are confused, they leave them by themselves for the cold harsh world to raise them, the television, the media, bad company and they naturally become products of their environment. It's like the children are being sacrificed, just thrown to the dogs.
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http://www.imdb.com/list/_OaGg-zdQKo/</B>;
Baba, past posts by the poster you are responding to indicate that he believes that everything that happens in the film is just Bill's daydreaming fantasies, that nothing actually 'happens' in the film, as this thread makes clear:
HTTP://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120663/board/thread/260527511
I'm left wondering if this 'barbed' pseudo-chap even exists, as 'he' comes across as another internet basketcase.
Haha well I dunno about all that now, that discussion seems pretty out of my depth. But maybe this quote by Kubrick could help. ''Art consists of reshaping life but it does not create life, nor cause life.''
http://www.imdb.com/list/_OaGg-zdQKo/
Ouch Monkey. I actually think another poster summed it up best re: that particular thread: The film is too real to be a dream, and too dream like to be real.
Monkey, yet another sad sock. I've never had to make a sock, myself. Interesting...
Back to this thread - It is implied in the made for TV version of Dream Story that Milich's daughter was at Somerton (different names in the book/TV version of course) - was this implied in the book? Haven't been able to track it down to read yet unfortunately.
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I've mentioned before here they Zeigler's wife is named Ilena (a variation of Helena/Helen). And what about Helen of Troy? This Wikipedia excerpt is interesting:
The legends of Helen during her time in Troy are contradictory: Homer depicts her ambivalently, both regretful of her choice and sly in her attempts to redeem her public image. Other accounts have a treacherous Helen who simulated Bacchic rites and rejoiced in the carnage she caused. Ultimately, Paris was killed in action, and in Homer's account Helen was reunited with Menelaus, though other versions of the legend recount her ascending to Olympus instead. A cult associated with her developed in Hellenistic Laconia, both at Sparta and elsewhere; at Therapne she shared a shrine with Menelaus. She was also worshiped in Attica and on Rhodes.
Helen boards a ship for Troy, fresco from the House of the Tragic Poet in Pompeii
Her beauty inspired artists of all times to represent her, frequently as the personification of ideal human beauty. Images of Helen start appearing in the 7th century BC. In classical Greece, her abduction by Paris—or escape with him—was a popular motif. In medieval illustrations, this event was frequently portrayed as a seduction, whereas in Renaissance paintings it was usually depicted as a "rape" (i. e. abduction) by Paris.
no, Bill looked quite disgusted with Milich.
shareOr was he disgusted with himself for entertaining the idea? I think thoughts entered Bill's head there, and he might have been tempted, but I doubt he would have ever done that. Not during the film, anyway. Had he continued down the rabbit hole...? Who knows. I think Milich's "establishment" showed the grotesque allure of lust, and I think Bill was grossed out, but also intrigued. I think he wished Milich had called the police because that would have put an end to it all - closed the chapter handily. I also think it's possible that the masque people had Milich in their pay...maybe that's part of the game...?
shareoic
could be Bill realized "hey.. i could be those japanese dudes.. with no consequence"
we will never know but that's curious.
he DID go back to see the hooker Domino and was ready to bang her roomie.
He was definitely teetering on the brink of many, many bad decisions throughout the film. I think Milich's daughter was one of those "teetering" moments. I think it's important that his forays into infidelity all have that "shadow side", too. Milich's daughter is underage, the sex cult are very dangerous and powerful, and Domino had that blood test.
The journey seems to be about playing with fire and getting burned, in some ways...
I thought that as well.
share