MovieChat Forums > Grey's Anatomy (2005) Discussion > The premiere

The premiere

posted 8 years ago by theothertwistedsister
28 replies | jump to latest

So, I had some thoughts:

The baby's name: I'm half expecting them to be like "haha, we were just messing with you it's not harriette" next episode, or at very least they'll do the weird thing where they call the baby by its middle name like they do with a lot of the kids. I don't see them calling a baby harriette, at very least. I do like the hyphenated name and scene that accompanied it. Katherine needs to learn boundaries and that set that up nicely.

Now the big stuff...

Jo/Deluca/Alex: I'm kind of sad that I'm seeing people blaming Jo for this and saying it's her fault. That's ridiculous. The only one at fault here is Alex, who acted on impulse without taking a second to understand the situation. Jo was giggling when she was on the bed, so at best, if they were about to have sex, that implies she was probably on board. So I have trouble believing that Alex actually thought DeLuca was forcing himself on her. If Alex had known straight out that she was drunk and thus couldn't consent (because I don't think he was aware beforehand to my memory, but I could be wrong) then yes, but what it seemed like he was reacting to was that he walked in on a hook up, not assault. if that's the case, that means his actions were from his own aggression and poor judgement. I love Alex, but he is 100% in the wrong here, not Andrew, not Jo. Alex punched first, and then didn't even bother to ask later.

Mer: I also have seen people saying Mer shouldn't have said anything and all that, and I feel like this is a great case of Mer being damned if she does, damned if she doesn't both on the show and in the viewer's perception. Mer HAD to tell. When you're in a job with a duty to report, you're supposed to report even if you just have a suspicion with reason. I work with kids and teens, and if I even suspect something I'm duty bound to report it. If it's found out later that I didn't report a suspicion and it was something that needed legal intervention I can face legal consequences, lose my job etc. Doctors have a similar duty to report. She had to do it. People seem to be saying "she should've stayed loyal!" But if she had and not shared, people would've been saying "she should've told! Where's the realism in her risking her job and future!". People on the show are mad that she didn't tell soon enough, and I'm sure there will be people who are mad that she told at all, but at the end of the day,they are not interns/residents anymore, and the fact that she did tell and actually do the right thing shows me that maybe, juuuusssstt maybe, they'll actually have Meredith grow more this season. And the little scene at the end with Mer and Alex was good, and it shows me that they're both growing up. The original 2 left who were the biggest bailers when they were younger are actually facing up to their problems. If the situation wasn't so *beep* it would be great haha

Jo/Alex: really quick thought, but did anyone get serious S2 Mer/Der vibes from that "you're incapable of this" speech from Alex to Jo tonight? It reminded me of when Derek was all the sudden furious at Mer when she started seeing Finn and he called her a whole. It's not a great moment for either Alex or Derek but it was an interesting callback.

[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] jncarriere 8 years ago

Alex at the time believed,Jo was being sexually assaulted. I don't believe he would of reacted the way he did otherwise. Jo is married and that is a secret you should not keep and especially from someone you love and trust enough to live with and considering having and a child with.

No it wasn't Jo's fault,but the road leading up to it is. It's what they call "cause and effect" and I hope they stay apart.

“imperfection is an altogether attainable human goal,” and “love is acceptance of imperfections.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

But why would he think she was being assaulted? Look at the facts:

A) they'd just had a huge fight and it seemed like a break up level fight.

B) he didn't know she was drunk beforehand (so that couldn't be his excuse, that she was being assaulted because she was too drunk to consent)

C) when Alex walked in Jo was on the bed giggling. Why would her giggling make him assume assault over a regular hook up?

I understand that he thought it afterwards, that she was being attacked, but why would he think that ahead of time? I can see him justifying it after the fact as that, but I can't understand how he could suss out the situation in the 2.3 seconds before he started punching.

[–] jncarriere 8 years ago

You are absolutely right, I went back and watched the end scene again. The sorta half smile was there and no he wouldn't have known she was drunk (unless I missed that to). I believed him when he said,sexual assault.

Sorry about that I was wrong.

“imperfection is an altogether attainable human goal,” and “love is acceptance of imperfections.

[–] bailey96 8 years ago

i think the problem people are having is the level of his reaction, if he'd punched him once or even twice, blacked his eye or split a lip, I think people would at least understand but not remotely approve of the reaction to finding a guy on top of his girl, a guy who knew she was taken (and even if they had broken up that evening a hookup would be shady). the problem though is that alex has been through so much trauma over the course of his entire life that his reactions aren't tempered, his fight or flight response is not normal.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] jncarriere 8 years ago

I agree completely and I understand why he did it. There is no "justification" for it and I like Alex. So for me personally,I needed a "reason" beyond the past trauma. Like Alex,I thought he had grown. I hope his "redemption" journey will show him having counseling.

“imperfection is an altogether attainable human goal,” and “love is acceptance of imperfections.

[–] bailey96 8 years ago

as someone who works with trauma victims, i don't know that he needs redemption or to grow up, he's done both, he needs help and treatment. trauma particularly that much trauma over a prolonged period of time has a profound effect on behavior. i'm not excusing his actions and feel badly for deluca but i think alex has been a victim and victimized too much of the time to view his actions as purely criminal or demonstrating a lack of maturity or poor character. he's not different than hunt choking christina the biggest difference between the two is that alex has such serious trust issues and masks with attitude that he makes himself appear unlikable. no one knows how good a person he is or what he has been through save meredith.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] jncarriere 8 years ago

as someone who works with trauma victims, i don't know that he needs redemption or to grow up, he's done both, he needs help and treatment.

You misunderstood what I meant.Grown (I didn't say grow up)and meant that he has changed and evolved like we all do. Redemption,yes he does need to redeem himself and to do that,he needs to apologize and seek counseling. His reputation at this moment has been damaged,I think he needs to redeem himself and that is what redemption means.

“imperfection is an altogether attainable human goal,” and “love is acceptance of imperfections.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

Yeah, that's definitely how I saw it.

I'm wondering if they're going to spin it differently later though, because I could see them rewriting or retconning it later like they have with stories before. Like maybe they'll show a scene where Alex runs into Stephanie at the hospital and she says Jo just left the bar wasted or something so he would've known she was drunk?

[–] silent_girl_k 8 years ago

Alex could have picked up on Jo being drunk in 2 ways:

A) He's seen her drunk before, so he knows how she sounds, behaves etc.

B) Given how drunk she was acting, he could probably smell the alcohol, and given the fact that Deluca reacted so quickly it was clear he wasn't drunk, meaning the smell would have been coming from Jo

None of this justifies his actions. 1 punch followed by a call to the police would have been understandable, but instead he let all the pain and rage he was feeling out on Deluca. And he did realize that he'd gone wayyyyyyyy too far even before he found out he'd been mistaken about it being a case of assault.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

As to the point where he's seen her drunk before, yes, but he was in the room for like 2 seconds. He saw her lying on the bed and laughing, not walking around slurring words and stumbling around. I can't see that he would draw that conclusion immediately without her saying something outright.

And as for a smell, we'll I suppose that could be plausible, but it seems like it's stretching imo.

I just think that with the way the scene was set up and executed, the most logical conclusion would be that he would think it's a hook up over an assault, and then when he did realize after the fact that she was drunk he justified his actions.

That said, I'm SURE we're going to revisit that scene many times over the next few Episodes, and because he's a main character and all that, I'm sure they'll justify it as such and he'll get a slap on the wrist and be able to stay on at GSM somehow (because unless they've kept it very secret, JC seems to be sticking around)

[–] eileen-guthrie555 8 years ago

I can hear her saying... we were on a break.

I do think her giggling would have been a small clue that she wasn't being attacked or raped.

[–] Sam-953-169285 8 years ago

I watched the episode so thank you but I don't need a text version of it.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

Then why bother even responding? I'm fine if you don't want to discuss it with me, but why come onto a discussion board, find a post you think is too long and respond saying something to that effect? Haha

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

I just went back and re-watched the scene and while you can tell she is clearing giggling at first, towards the end of it, it almost sounds like she is cry giggling. When Alex first walked in, he probably wasn't paying attention.

I think the problem is that we as viewers know what really happened but the characters don't always know. It's easy to say well "she was giggling, he should have know that wasn't happening" or "I have a hard time believing Alex actually thought that".

It's very possible that when Alex came in to the apartment he wasn't pay attention so he didn't hear her laughing, kind of like when someone is talking to you and you are looking straight at them, but you didn't hear half of what they said. When he comes in,he first starts to look down and once he rounds the bookshelf he's smiling. It reminds me of when someone is almost daydreaming or zoned out.

After tonight and seeing how he was explaining it to Mer, I really believe he thought she was being assaulted. The key word, is he "believed". I'm not saying what he did was right but I can also see how he could have perceived things.

[–] mgreen9715 8 years ago

I love the fact that people are justifying Alex's behavior because he thought Jo was being sexually assaulted/raped/whatever. Nice way to try and re-write what was already shown on screen.

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

I'm not justifying his behavior, he was wrong, I get that, but just because we as viewers know how it actually all went down, doesn't mean the characters know. I dont see how anywhere in my post I re-wrote what we already saw. It's a TV show not real life.

[–] Gigi_Marie 8 years ago

The only reason Alex brought up thinking Jo was being assaulted was because he was trying to give himself, as well as her, an out. I'm an Alex fan but I don't believe for a second that when he walked into the loft he thought Jo was getting raped. He was looking for any excuse to cling to to make himself feel better about what he did. He was practically begging Jo to say "Yes, he was assaulting me."

What the hell is a Stiles?

[–] gctattoo2 8 years ago

I have to agree. It was definitely him trying to justify when he did. When there is no justification. Regardless of any circumstance he thought he was walking into, the only thing that needed to be done was to separate the two. If that takes a punch or two, so be it. But he pounded on that man out of rage. If you believe it was an attempted rape, then you call the police.

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

I disagree about if he really thought she was being assaulted. When Mer told him what actually happened, he truly seemed surprised and then it seemed like he was like *beep* I had it all wrong". But that's the thing about TV shows we can all have our own opinions on it, doesn't mean your opinion is right and mines wrong, or that mines right and yours is wrong.

[–] Gigi_Marie 8 years ago

By the time that Meredith told Alex the truth about what happened Jo had already told him it hadn't been a case of assault. After she denied DeLuca assaulting her Alex got pissed and wouldn't let her explain further because he believed that if she wasn't being raped, then they must have been in the process of hooking up. He wasn't surprised to hear that she wasn't getting raped, he was surprised to hear that they hadn't been about to have consensual sex after all.

As far as whether he truly believed at the time he walked in that Jo was getting raped, you're right, it's all speculation right now. I guess only Shonda and the writers know the truth lol.

What the hell is a Stiles?

[–] mgreen9715 8 years ago

But your opinion is wrong because it's proven wrong by FACTS. It's a TV show? You don't say!

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

No my Opinion isn't wrong, nor is it right. It's my opinion, it's how I feel. I'm aloud to feel or think anyway I please and the same goes for you.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

When I say I have a hard time believing something like this, I usually mean that I have a hard time believing that the writers would write it that way, and that there's a chance they'll spin it otherwise as the story unfolds.But then they've done some spectacularly bad writing when it comes to legal issues on the show so who knows how they'll write it haha

I personally don't hear the cry laughing but I guess it's all about interpretation which I think will be the crux of Alex's defense at this point

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

At first i didn't hear it either, but i happened to not be watching computer screen when it happened and thats when i heard it and i thought "wow if i heard that and wasn't looking at what happened, I would totally thinking she was crying or whimpering. Alex wasn't able to see either of them until after he came around the bookshelf, so maybe that's what he heard too.

That's what great about this board sometimes, is when people can have a decent discussion about a subject and it be civil. Its nice to hear how others see things. Thanks for the nice reply, I've seen some other posters getting pissy and attacking others for their POV on the matter.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

Haha yeah, I've had some nasty encounters on this board too. But I love discussing the show (I study narratives for a living, so this is something I do naturally when watching something, and I like to share my thoughts without the ramification of grades or what have you). I also like to see how others see it differently than I do.

I think they probably made the scene so ambiguous because it'll be like the multiple point of view ep with Ben last season. Maybe they'll hype up the "it sounded like she was crying" from Alex's POV, but they'll hype up the laughing from Deluca's.

I just hope they don't demonize Deluca for pressing charges, which I could see them doing. He's totally justified in pressing charges because at the end of the day, he did nothing wrong whether Alex perceived it that way or not.

[–] kem7696 8 years ago

Honestly I would understand why Deluca would press charges on Alex, this wasn't just a little fight, he beat the crap out of him.

I'm very interested to see how this plays out. Unless Alex is leaving the show and we don't know about it, we know that he wont be sent to prison (maybe do jail time, but i doubt prison), but will he loose his job and if he does, for how long. Will people take sides, will Jo and Alex get back together(I hope not, I don't like them together). I think there are so many possibilities.

[–] theothertwistedsister 8 years ago

Yeah Deluca would be totally justified in pressing charges. I can still see them making him look like petty or vengeful or something in doing so. I hope they don't do that, because DeLuca actually stands a chance at being a good character, so I hope they don't trash his character that way.

One of the things I thought might happen is that they'll have him go to jail for part of the season (with time jumps added in because that's GA's favurite thing haha) and he'll stay on the show via scenes where Meredith visits him at the jail at the beginning/end of each episode like they had with Addison and her therapist on PP. Then, he'll be released and will be able to keep his medical license (because maybe they can plead it down to a misdemeanour charge or something, which he could in theory still be able to practice medicine with) and his job because the owners of the hospital love him. Maybe they'll show him going through a probationary period or something.

Basically I want them to do anything but have him just not be charged because Andrew drops the charges or something haha