MovieChat Forums > The Prestige (2006) Discussion > Great Concept Great Acting but (Spoilers...

Great Concept Great Acting but (Spoilers)

posted 9 years ago by homergreg
18 replies | jump to latest

How could Angier not figure out Borden was twins? I'm not a magician, and it didn't take me 5 minutes when they were pondering how "he did it" to come up with the answer, and was darned sure of it. It wasn't very long after the realization that they were twins to figure out the whole "today you love me part" either, and the one sacrificing his fingers for the sake of the act part as well. Then we get to go off the deep end to give Angier his twins, and as soon as I saw all the hats, I was certain Angier was still alive. I had suspected that it was his double, Root, before that. The last 45 minutes or so was just waiting for the movie to end. I didn't figure out what Angier was doing with all the twins, but I get it, he was killing himself over and over.

This was a great story about a toxic rivalry building and consuming these characters far before we got to the point of needing any kind of natural or fantasy human duplication involved to finish it up. The twists were predictable and actually took me out of a story in which I was immersed so deeply. Save the twists for the stories that need them.

I really wish this story just stuck to the basics that were serving it so well.

[–] mad_weather 9 years ago

A) Keep in mind that we as viewers were given information from both parts of the story, and Angier only makes conclusions from facts known to *him*.
B) Angier isn't very bright when it comes to solving and creating illusions. Just look at the scene with Chinese magician, where Borden is all analytical, while Angier settles on being amazed (and therefore loses the competition). Amazement is his main motivation behind choosing magician's career in the first place. He *wants* to believe in a complex illusion.

__________________________________
Oh my god! They killed Angier!
YOU BASTARDS!!!

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

I understand what you mean about Borden being more about analysis and Angier being more about amazement. There were years of plotting and studying each other, not to conceive that he did have a double and he was right there, same size, just in a hat and some stage makeup just doesn't make that part of the story credible for me. He was right there every performance, but not there right when the trick happened. He allowed his life to be consumed by Borden's secret and never looked twice at the man standing at his side as part of it?

That was just too much a stretch for me to readily accept, and it did hinder enjoying an otherwise very enjoyable story for me. If I try to put myself in Angier's place, one timeline, blind with contempt, and my mission in life is to figure out how he's doing it, I just don't see it.

Otherwise, beautiful scenes, great acting, intriguing story.

[–] mad_weather 9 years ago

That's the very point of Borden's trick - he was maniacally creative in maintaining the illusion that he *doesn't* use a double. An assumption that a mere double would sacrifice his own fingers for the sake of a trick seems to be a bit over the top for a regular person.

(And no, a viewer that knows he's watching the movie where he's supposed to look for hidden misdirection can not count as a regular person)

__________________________________
Oh my god! They killed Angier!
YOU BASTARDS!!!

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

That's where we differ, and it's all good. I feel that many members of an audience of a magic show would actually be looking for some hidden misdirection. In everyday situations, not when someone is looking for a magic trick, I would have found it entirely plausible.

That's the beauty of movies, not everyone sees things the same way.

[–] LoneStarG84 9 years ago

Well good for you for "figuring out" that Fallon was a Borden twin. I certainly didn't. I've shown the movie to numerous people and none of them spotted it either.

Why are people so freaking analytical and critical with every film they watch? Why can't you just sit back and enjoy it? Focus on its merits instead of its perceived flaws? There's such a stringent standard all films must adhere to nowadays that isn't applied to other art forms like music, television, theater, concerts, etc., that it's no wonder Hollywood has all but given up on originality. The internet absolutely will not tolerate originality, no matter how loud they are in demanding it. I certainly don't watch movies trying to "figure out the twist", I can't imagine how much of a grueling experience that must be. I just watch, and let things happen on their own.

took me out of a story

No matter how much I ponder over this very common phrase, I've never been able to understand it. Like, do you actually believe you're... in the movie? Like, is that a thing? And then something you don't like happens and suddenly you're... out? You're not in the movie anymore? I don't think I've ever been so immersed in any movie that I'm jarred when something weird happens. Am I alone in this? Is there some trippy, out-of-body experience I've been missing out on all this time? Do I need a chemical substance of some kind?

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

First: I really liked the movie. I'm not crazy analytical on all movies, but when I'm watching a movie about magic tricks, and the lead character is trying to figure out the trick, I try to figure out the trick as well. If I wasn't watching magicians perform, I would be in a different mindframe. I accept that as a personal preference, and I have no issue with anyone who feels otherwise. We all experience the stories we receive differently, and that's a good thing.

When I say I'm "in a story", I mean that the story has me very inattentive to anything else going on around me. I don't know if it's common on not, but when I'm in a great story like this one was, I'm very inattentive to the world around me. And it's a fantastic feeling. My wife doesn't agree with that when she asks me questions in that state, and I'm oblivious to it, but she does thankfully get over it.

The whole twin part broke that focus for me, if just because this character who's life mission became figuring the trick out didn't bother examining the gentleman who was by his antagonist's side. And it did that for me, I do apologize that it broke that hold on me, but that's my personal experience with this movie.

It didn't make it a bad movie at all, but up until it took that turn, it was one of those perfect movies for me.

I'm not hating on it.

[–] the-author 9 years ago

In the book, Angier goes to great lengths to see borden's two siblings and neither resembles alfred. He even checks for hospital papers/birth records and no mention of a twin brother. so, Angier was convinced there had to be some other way. this is what led him to believe that Tesla had a working machine and pursued him vigorously to get one made for himself.

Best unknown feature at IMDB.com
http://www.imdb.com/features/video/browse/

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

That's pretty interesting. Thanks's for the information! I wonder if there were deleted scenes depicting this, or just a screenwriting edit from the novel.

I had not heard of the novel, reading the synopsis of it just now is intriguing. Too bad I saw the movie first, but I may pick it up anyway. I really enjoyed the characters learning about each other through reading each other's journals. An entire novel built of them, with the twists revealed through each other's eyes, that sounds like a great work.

[–] yurenchu 9 years ago

Too bad I saw the movie first, but I may pick it up anyway.

Yes, I can certainly recommend reading the novel! I read it after having watched the movie, and I did not regret it at all. It's a captivating read.

The novel is quite different from the movie, it takes a different approach, takes more time to explore the lives of the protagonists and the world of magic, has a different plot, several different characters, and a completely different ending. So you'll be in for some surprises. However, surprisingly enough the movie managed to explore the same (or similar) themes and keep the same atmosphere as the novel.

______
Joe Satriani - "Always With Me, Always With You"
http://youtu.be/VI57QHL6ge0

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

Thanks I'm ordering the novel now!

[–] homergreg 9 years ago

Thank you and "the-author", so very much for mentioning the novel!

I really enjoyed the book! It handled Angiers' investigation of Borden so much better. I thought the elements of the feud between the magicians in the book were more enjoyable and made, to me, the characters more human.

It makes sense that there were some major differences between the story in the movie and the book, as I'm not sure all of the elements of the book would have transitioned well to the action of the movie.

I still do like both the movie and the book. The movie was a bit more exciting. I find I appreciate the characters and their motivations to do what they did more in the book though.

[–] baj2 9 years ago

I find I appreciate the characters and their motivations to do what they did more in the book though.

I agree - I read the book at the time that the movie was in production.

The film dwelt very strongly on the theme of extreme obsession while there were other interesting background details and plot developments in the book.

I guess what eventually happened to Angier in the end might be too weird for a film for the general moviegoing public

[–] search_for_truth 9 years ago

This is a bit of an aside, but speaking of the book ... I saw an interview with the book's author, Christopher Priest, where he said that The Prestige and Memento are Christopher Nolan's only good movies, and he thinks Christopher Nolan is essentially a sell-out.

[–] SweetTeaPi 8 years ago

Regarding Priest's reported comment on Nolan's "selling out", not sure if he is referring to Inception, Interstellar, or the Batman trilogy. I will agree that TDKR is the weakest of the listed movies, but Nolan has shown himself to be a talented director. I have read The Prestige, and believe me, Nolan greatly improved it. And Priest has no room to talk. Several of his books and short stories are pretty much garbage. To me, he is the sell out.

[–] Trax-3 8 years ago

Well good for you for "figuring out" that Fallon was a Borden twin. I certainly didn't. I've shown the movie to numerous people and none of them spotted it either.

I didn't spot it either. At first I was distracted by the idea that it was Borden who was doing "real magic" so the need for a double didn't even cross my mind. I first started to suspect it towards the end when Borden and "Fallon" meet in prison but I dismissed the idea because I couldn't see through Fallon's disguise. The film is clever, because all other disguises both magicians employ are very easy to see trough and wouldn't even deceive a child, so we perhaps subconsciously accept that the makeup department is not up to the challenge.

[–] klandersen 8 years ago

I too admit I didn't figure out the "twin" part. At one point I did think Fallon could be a brother, but was not thinking "twin". I was thinking more along the lines of using a duplicate like Angier was doing with Root. At the time I was still a little confused between Borden and Angier as at first I didn't pay too much attention to the characters. After the twin reveal it connected the rest of the dots.

I was also trying to figure out how the tricks were being done. I have always tried doing that. I love seeing those "how do they do that?" shows that reveal magic trick secrets and more related to movies the behind the scenes specials that actually show how the effects were done. Not just those specials that say "oh they used CGI and a green screen" well duh but they didn't actually show any behind the scenes footage that reveals the techniques.

"Snag it, Bag it, Tag it!" ~ WAREHOUSE 13

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] homergreg 8 years ago

Since January when I posted that right after watching the film, I've come to "get" and appreciate the work more. On first viewing of a film with a twist, I relish being fooled and having to rewatch, and in this case, that part didn't happen for me because of Angier's easy dismissal of Borden not being a twin.

Later I came to accept and appreciate how blind Angier was as his flaw, but I did want to be fooled just like Angier was in a movie like this and that just didn't happen.

After reading the book, I do believe that if Angier would have taken some of the same steps to disprove Borden being a twin that were described in the book, that the twist would have been much more effective for me.

Do I "get it" now, or is there something else to perceive here?