I'll tell you right now, the one thing I wouldnt be doing is defending The movie at all costs
Campea is exactly what DC fans should have been doing immediately after BvS
There should have been absolute chaos and outrage that Snyder was coming back for JL....DC fans should have protested, had DC fans just been real instead of going into this delusional state where they relentlessly defended BvS, Had they been Angry, Had they excepted reality, had they like everyone else been disgusted by what WB and Snyder did with BvS, Theres no way WB could have brought Snyder back for JL
for some ODD reason, the DCEU films got labeled "Decisive" despite being anything but Decisive"....These films were universally Hated and disappointed on every level, THey got labeled "Decisive" because DC fans went into FULL Delusional, conspiracy theories mode in relentless defending these films....this lead WB to believe there was a disconnect between Audiences and Critics, When in reality, There was Universally agreement,
EVERYONE hated things films, Both Audiences and Critics, based on anyway you judge a film, BvS,SS and JL were Hated by The Majority, The Problem was the small Minority of Hardcore DC fans just went FULL RETARD in defense of these awful movies resulting in WB thinking the Films were "Decisive"
DC fans Cut their own throats,their absolute relentless and Shameless defense of these awful movies led WB to make no major changes, Lead WB to bring back Snyder time and time again
There should have been A Meltdown after BvS from DC fans....WB should have been in a position where they HAD to Fire Snyder, Instead DC fans defended the movie SO MUCH it gave WB the excuse to bring him back.
Theres only one thing I dont know if Campea is right about, I dont know if DC fans "deserve better"
Hes right about saying you can maybe LIMP forward with this DCEU but why, It would be much more successful too start over
Audiences and Critics deserve a better DCEU, I just dont think DC Fans do
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Honestly I do not know why anyone would be excited for BVS after seeing Man of Steel. Here is the thing I was super excited for Man of Steel. I really was I was like okay finally they are rebooting Superman and it is his chance to make a comeback. In the same way Batman Begins restored people's faith in Batman.
Well the issue is Snyder took all the wrong notes on what made Nolan's Batman work. The studio had a one size fits all mentality. Oh the dark, gritty, realistic tone worked for Batman therefore it will work for Superman as well. They are not considering that the reason it worked for Batman is he is a dark, broodingm gritty character. Yeah Nolan took away the fantasy element but even in a fantasy setting Batman is dark, gritty, and brooding. Superman is not those things. It is okay to darken it up a little bit but not to the extent they did it.
You do not have to be as lighthearted as the Donner films but Superman needs to be something we aspire to look up to. The next problem is the lack of creativity and originality.
Man of Steel suffered from the same problem amazing Spider-man did. It goes over story beats we have already seen done before. The origin of Superman was done by Donner and it was amazing. Now at least amazing Spider-man changed the villain and love interest. I am not a fan of the amazing spider-man films but still I will give them that. Zod was in the first Superman film. Not the main villain but he was set up and introduced. So literally it is a modernized Superman 1 and 2 subtract Lex Luthor and splice in some Batman Begins cliff notes.
It is Superman 1 and 2 plus Batman Begins in a blender. Instead of the lighthearted tone Donner did it is now dreary serious and dull. Batman Begins worked so well because it did completely new things we have never seen with the character on the big screen. We had never seen Batman's origin before it was only ever alluded to. We had not seen Ras Al Ghul, we had not seen Scarecrow. The story blueprint was different.
next post.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Spider-man Homecoming was better than the amazing Spider-man films. I still do not think it was as good as Raimi's and overall I am not head over heels for it but it did something new with Spider-man.
So after seeing Man of Steel and being utterly crushed I knew that what was coming next would not be good. First introducing Batman back to the big screen so quick was a mistake. Nolan made amazing films so to follow up that quickly bad idea. Aside from that though here is the next problem.
Since they made Superman dark and brooding like Batman now where is the contrast? Him and Batman are the same character. So that is why they had to basically make Batman the punisher because both of them are dark and brooding. So they made him kill because I mean how can you make him darker right? The reason Captain America and Iron Man, or Punisher and Daredevil facing each other is interesting is because of the contrast between the two.
The romance between Adams and Cavill is a joke. Compare that to Margot Kidder and Reeve and it is just asinine how much it fails. Lois feels tacked on. So then once I realized that they were trying to emulate the MCU and rush this stuff out as quick as they possibly could I knew BVS would be a disaster. I never have liked any of Snyder's work anyway. He can give you great visuals but his narrative in all of his films is always hollow.
Snyder was controlling the project and then how much they were packing in was also a red flag. The only good DCU film was Wonder Woman.
The reason being is it was standalone and understood the character. Was it a masterpiece no but it was a good film.
However when you only hit 1/5 that is pretty bad. The MCU even at its worst never sunk to the lows of the DCU. That is why MCU is kicking its ass quite Frankly.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"However when you only hit 1/5 that is pretty bad. The MCU even at its worst never sunk to the lows of the DCU. That is why MCU is kicking it's ass quite Frankly. "
Your grammar sucks, my bitch. :)
It's "kicking its ass" and not kicking"it's ass"
Still want to "teach" anyone about grammar, bitch? And you still wonder why I don't even bother to reply to your asinine whining ass?
PS - and careful with the absence of comas in your sentences. It makes you look like a complete millennial moron. :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Um read the post again smart one. Its is spelled correctly. It was posted two hours ago therefore I have not touched it. Second I know your sorry ass is not trying to go that direction. The reason you do not back up your points is because you are full of shit.
According to you a movie is better than another if it makes more money. Remember we debated critical reception and you ran away from the point.
Logan beats any MCU movie to date this year critically. There must have been some conspiracy behind why that got highly rated as well right? Remember the filter determines the quality of the film. The acting, writing, cinematography, music, set design, and sound have nothing to do with it. It all is determined by the filter...
The MCU does not have the genre pegged in best critically acclaimed by fans or critics.
Superman the movie, and Spider-man 2 are all received better than anything MCU.
Now piss off and let the adults speak.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"Um read the post again smart one. Its is spelled correctly"
that EDIT button is useful huh? AHAH. you were caught, fuckface.
PS - Keep crying my bitch. You know I'm your daddy. :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
When the post shows it was done two hours ago is useful as well huh?
You got owned fuckboy go learn better English.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
" Was it a masterpiece no but it was a good film. "
USE COMAS, YOU FUCKING MORON!
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[deleted]
7 years ago
I have no idea what a coma is do you mean comma?
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
It seems you know, bitch :)
PWNED
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[deleted]
7 years ago
USE COMAS, YOU FUCKING MORON!
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
Exactly. It defeats your "argument" of you "not understanding" my "grammar". :)
PWNED x2
PS - unlike you, I don't go back and EDIT shit, bitch. :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Edit? I made a mistake in not adding a comma and can admit it. I have not edited anything. Funny thing is in trying to correct me you misspelled a word yourself. Utterly destroying the foundation on which you stand. Keep going this is hilarious.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Let me help you this is a coma.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coma/symptoms-causes/syc-20371099
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
Let me help you, this is you getting an anal probe:
https://gamesided.com/files/2016/02/CartmanGetsAnAnalProbe.jpg
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[deleted]
7 years ago
I would love that show me more it is turning me on.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
I would love that show me more it is turning me on
Your gagging grammar is atrocious, bitch :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
It is because I was so entranced by that anal probe. Show me more.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
That you are a faggot is pretty clear. :)
You love me to give you attention. But my bitches have to work hard for it.
Keep it up, you're on the right track. Soon enough you'll be my favorite :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Also interesting how you're not putting periods at the end of your sentences.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
I don't have periods. You obviously have a lot of them. Must be hard :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Oh I know I am so sorry. I need to be nice. I mean you did not know the difference between comma and coma. How could you know what I am referring to here. So sad you did not finish your GED.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
Did your brain just farted? Or are you just quitting? I'd be sad if you were a quitter. Daddy doesn't like when his bitches quit. :(
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Back up your points with logic, or you have conceded. If you will not back up your claims your credibility is shot . So what will it be?
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
For a moment I thought you had quit your whining. I'm so glad you are back at it, though it took you some time to come around... but I forgive you. :)
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[deleted]
7 years ago
No worries here. I think it's funny you think money means quality.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
It's funny you think so when I said nothing of the sort anywhere. :)
More whining, please. I thirst!
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[deleted]
7 years ago
You claimed MCU movies were better than any other comic book movie because of box office.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
Not only did I ever say so, nor implied such thing, I often state [right here at this same forum] that revenue and quality are two very different things [and often give the example of the Twilight saga, 50 Shades and Transformer movies as movies who make a lot of money and suck ass].
Your attempt at reaching for straws is laughable though. More whining! My cup is empty!
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Oh I am not grasping at straws. We were discussing MCU movies vs other comic book films. Donner, Raimi, and Nolan came up.
We were talking reception from fans and critics. You then proceeded to tell me that the MCU shits all over Nolan's movies because of the box office gross.
You resorted to that because the reception favors other movies. Spider-man 2 is higher received than any MCU film to date.
The reason you did that is because you are salty MCU doesn't reign supreme critically.
Thing is I never even said the MCU is bad. There are some good films they have. All I said was there are other comic book films that I think are on par with some of their, and some which I think are better.
Superman the movie, Spider-man 2, and The Dark Knight is better than anything MCU.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
MCU does shit all over Nolan for sheer scope. You are aggravated still because you love the TDK trilogy... which is ok... overrated as all hell, but hey... it's your thing. Don't care.
Dude... seriously, the only time I say "box office" is when I want to take a piss at something. I don't care for the Box Office numbers. Box Office only tells me people like what they pay to see [when and if they come back for more; such is the example of the MCU and not the example of the DCEU, which is losing audiences]
And again, I don't care for reception numbers, critic numbers or reviews. I care for quality.
An example: Batman Begins I think is a good movie [the best of the trilogy]. Saw it 2 times at the theaters. Liked it a lot at the time, and I'm not even a Batman fan [I am a Bale fan, though]
The DK one made me yawn to tears and I don't care for Ledger's Joker part. And the third one I couldn't care less about.
Spiderman 2... saw it at the theaters, didn't like it. Don't care for whining spiderman, nor Doc Oc nor the annoying bitch he was in love with. Liked the first one, though.
So yeah... TDK is terribly overrated just because of Ledger's death [same thing happens when any actor or other artist dies. Suddenly there's a growing interest in whatever they were on. Example: the car movies with Vin Diesel got a renewed interest after the death of that other actor; Lou Reed sold more records and so did Bowie].
And the most hilarious thing is you thinking I'm a Marvelite. LMFAO. Wrong. I only care for 2 movies in the MCU [Civil War and Dr. Strange]
And now you are butt-hurt because... your feelings. :(
Fun though.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
In sheer scope but not in reception. We were arguing reception not scope. You veered off topic because you were losing the debate.
Also again we were not arguing MCU vs DC. We were arguing it vs other comic book movies. You're the one turning this into Marvel vs DC. The DCU outside of Wonder Woman is absolute trash! I am a DC fan and can openly admit that. See unlike you I am not being biased.
If you are wanting to wave scope of the MCU beating Nolan's movies or any others than we have the right to rave critical reception right back in your face. It is a better indicator of quality when something is well received.
Blade Runner tanked. That is considered a better movie than any MCU film to date. So yeah I will take the critical reception over scope and box office gross anyday. Do I always agree nope but it is a better indicator for sure.
You not liking TDK is fine but blaming Ledger's death for the reception is lame and lazy. Batman Begins and TDKR still got amazing reception critically. You act as if he was the only reason the movie was well received next post.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
The fast and the Furious made more money. Did it help the critical acclaim though? No it did not. The reception was only lukewarm at best. I believe Ledger's death helped as far as money goes but not in acclaim. You honestly believe The Dark Knight wouldn't have made a lot of money without his death? If so dream on.
Ledger's last film got no attention at all. It was also mixed critically. Not to mention James Gandolfini was in Enough Said he died before it was released. He was a main character did he get an Oscar nomination? He was in the Drop as well any Oscar nomination?
You say you do not care for numbers? Apparently not true. You quickly flashed those box office numbers to me when I was saying The Dark Knight was better received than any MCU film. So I am calling bullshit.
Funny thing is that was not what the initial debate was about to begin with. In short Spider-man 2 shits all over the MCU critically and there is no death excuse to bail your stupid ass out.
In order for me to convince people something is overrated you need to provide why. With The Dark Knight it is Ledger's death. That is your scapegoat cause you're lazy. When I said okay why is The Dark Knight Rises overrrated I heard crickets. The reason I heard them is you have no scapegoat.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
hat is your scapegoat cause you're lazy. When I said okay why is The Dark Knight Rises overrrated I heart crickets. The reason I heard them is you have no scapegoat.
Nah dude, it's because no matter what you are told you stick to your own shtick. You can't accept a different opinion and I have no patience to internet battle an opinion [or otherwise]. You take it or you don't. You clearly don't, and that's fine by me. But, when you started with the grammar nazi insults, as if the internet is any sort of place for anyone to show any modicum of care, and declared yourself as "better" [lol] you are no longer entitled to my POV unless I will it. I don't, so you don't get it.
PS - watch your grammar.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
" In short Spider-man 2 shits all over the MCU critically and there is no death excuse to bail your stupid ass out."
So, you base your opinion... on someone else's opinion, but forget the people who couldn't be bothered to even share theirs on the internet.
Which makes you an idiot.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
I can accept a different opinion. Thing is I asked you to elaborate and you went straight to the box office. Which shows me you have nothing to say.
The MCU is not considered the best when it comes to comic book films. You had nothing to say about The Dark Knight Rises getting good reception. As I said because you had no scapegoat.
So I am stupid for following the data of critical reception but you are not for saying MCU is better than the rest because of box office? Going by box office as quality makes you an idiot.
You were declaring yourself better before I pointed out grammar.
No I actually like Spider-man 2 more than the Dark Knight. The Dark Knight has better critical reception. However if I had to decide who to put more stock in between you and critics. I will choose the critics. They unlike you can back up their claims.
No response to the Ledger death thing I debunked I noticed.
PS- Make sure you spell comma right okay lol.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"I can accept a different opinion."
You clearly don't.
"Thing is I asked you to elaborate"
Therefore, you can't accept a different oppinion. I have no need to justify anything. You either take it or leave it.
"and you went straight to the box office. Which shows me you have nothing to say."
Box office means people went to see it and go back to see more of it. If that doesn't tell you anything, you are an idiot.
"The MCU is not considered the best when it comes to comic book films. "
Never said it was. I said I consider it as the best. Couldn't give two fucks to other opinions upon it. Neither do I care.
"You had nothing to say about The Dark Knight Rises getting good reception. "
Don't care. And it hurts you.
"So I am stupid for following the data of critical reception but you are not for saying MCU is better than the rest because of box office? Going by box office as quality makes you an idiot."
You are an idiot for thinking it matters to me and for not understanding what I said about it [the third time already]. So yes, you are an idiot.
"You were declaring yourself better before I pointed out grammar. "
Proof, please?
"No I actually like Spider-man 2 more than the Dark Knight. The Dark Knight has better critical reception. However if I had to decide who to put more stock in between you and critics. I will choose the critics. They unlike you can back up their claims. "
It's, like, their opinion dude, like... I don't care.
"No response to the Ledger death thing I debunked I noticed."
him not being overrated due to his death, is, like, your opinion dude... like... I don't care. Not everyone is a sheep like you.
"PS- Make sure you spell comma right okay lol. "
Make sure you spell "overrated" and "heard" correctly LOL
yes, I know. "Overrated" is a tough word for you. :) It is what it is.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
I spelled overrated and heard correctly, get your eyes checked.
Asking you to elaborate does not mean I can't accept another opinion. It means I am curious to hear why. You clammed up and got salty own it.
Box office obviously means people went to see it. It does not mean the reception was better critically. Get that through your thick skull. That is what I was debating to begin with. You veered off topic.
You said it was better because it beat every other comic book movie in the box office. Proof you're an idiot. You are not weaseling your way out of this.
I do not give a damn if you don't care about The Dark Knight Rises. I just found it funny that you will not comment on that one because there is no Ledger death scapegoat. Proof again you're full of shit.
Ledger getting good reception was not because of his death. Where was James Gandolfini's Oscar for his last two films? Movies that got good reception which he had main roles in, and yet no Oscar nomination. That completely debunks that claim.
It is not that I am a sheep it is that I do not take stupid claims at face value.
PS- spell comma correctly lol.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"I spelled overrated and heard correctly, get your eyes checked. "
No. You did not. But next time I'll take a screen shot so you can piss in your own mouth.
PS - Don't break that EDIT button.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Translation no response to my points. Pretty funny how in calling out my one mistake you misspelled comma. Epic fail there man.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
Watch that punctuation. It's "Translation:"
Funny is you using the Edit button to try and hide your mistakes :)
The irony... the irony...
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[deleted]
7 years ago
The irony of a man misspelling comma commenting on grammar is hilarious.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
the irony of a man misspelling overrated while commenting on grammar is hilarious.
PS - use proper punctuation. :)
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pinkled5 (125)
7 years ago
Grammar bashing just makes you look desperate. I haven't seen the movie and I'm interested in the argument, not a heartbroken fanboy reduced to comma patrol.
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prometheus1816 (1053)
6 years ago
>>>>>The only good DCU film was Wonder Woman. <<<<<
Wonder Woman as a good film? I'm a woman and I can say it did little to further our cause. Captain Marvel I'm going to look forward to because Marvel doens't pander. WW was a flop because it had "You like me, right?" written all over it. Loved how each man from Steve to even the enemy looked at her like she were the epitome of what womanhood should be about. Sorry but I like my heroines slightly on the shady side like Black Widow.
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ranmast (620)
7 years ago
^^^^^^^This, absolutely this. It was Crappy MoS what started all this. As a former DC fan, I got angry, protested and fought against this aberration called Man of Steel. But no, the stupid DC Fanboys and the Nolanites needed something to keep the fight against the Marvel Fans, whatever no matter how bad it was, even more after The Avengers banged TDKR's ass and they wanted ammunition. They were happy it made more money than Iron Man (a great victory for them), just the same retarded way they feel happy that Suicide Squad "Made more money than GotG without China" (ha, ha, ha...). So these retarded fans supported and defended this idiot and EMO Superman with their souls. I knew then that WB/DC had taken the wrong direction and stopped my support for the franchise.
I know, that at the end, they weren't that happy with the MOS product, but their jealousy (as Bill stated) and their craziness were the things that fueled this crap called DCEU. Had WB/DC listened to the real fans pleads, they had corrected and maybe today's history would have been different.
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actionkamen (23176)
7 years ago
I was excited to see BvS after thr dissapoinment that is MoS. Why?
Because at the time, I could understand why they made Superman dark and brooding. The Nolan's Batman was such a great success they have NO choice to not to follow it.
That I can understand.
When MoS apparently turned out not as good as I had hoped. I would like to see them make amends to it. That they would work as hard as they can to make sure BvS would not repeating the same mistakes taken by MoS.
That's why I had a high hope for BvS and actually excited to see it.
Obviously I was wrong and they let me down, again.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"Campea is exactly what DC fans should have been doing immediately after BvS"
You must have missed the episode in which Campea defended BvS like the second coming of Christ and everyone who didn't like it is practically an idiot.
He even gets a resurface of that awkward moment when - in this same video - he says that everyone should go see a Superman and Batman movie because it's a Superman and Batman movie [his DC love is very obvious. And even when he talks about the MCU his general demeanor reveals obvious jealousy - seriously, just pay attention to his body language].
DC fans and Marvel fans are pretty much the same schmucks you find in the Star Trek and Star War movies: men-children. Campea is one such example.
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billbrown7071 (3193)
7 years ago
You must have missed the episode in which Campea defended BvS like the second coming of Christ and everyone who didn't like it is practically an idiot.
^^^ no not at alll....Campea completely admits upfront He LOVES the DCEU films....Hes just not delusional like hardcore DC fans....
He understands that despite HIM LOVING BvS...Most did Not....he understands that Hes in the minority....
if it was SOLELY up to him, he would continue on with this DCEU....but he realizes that His Opinion Is not at all what the Majority feels....
He is a Die hard DC fan, that loves the DCEU films but to his credit he lives in reality.....He 100% sees the DCEU films have Lost their Audience....He sees that Despite Loving The DCEU Films it makes Zero sense to go forward because of The Damage that has been done...
He was talking about JL the other day and said "I keep hearing all the DC fans talking about The great WOM is going to kick in and carry the film.....and He goes "What Great Word of Mouth, what are you basing this on, Look I've seen the movie 4 times now, I really like it, I will recommend it to everyone, But My opinion that the movie is good is just not shared by the majority" He goes "The film got a B+ Cinemascore, thats the same as Baywatch and Fifty Shades Darker"...."You can not say Justice League has Great Word Of Mouth, The Box office Holds dont show it and The Audiences scores dont prove it"...."You May Love JL(I do) but its clear Most Do NOT"
He truly is what DC fans should be...He LOVES the DCEU films, But admts they have problems, excepts they have massively disappointed and Under Performed and Wants more than anything for WB to get it right....and He feels now that based on The Awful Structure that The DCEU has been built on, the only way to go forward is to Reboot....
I respect that...I have no problem anyone saying They Love BvS and JL....Just as long as they state it as Their Opinion.....
next post
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billbrown7071 (3193)
7 years ago
The Problem with DC fans is, they cant do that, They can't be happy saying "Ok so what, The Majority didnt like BvS, but I did and thats all I care about"
Instead they literally have to come up with Delusional conspiracy theories for why "Everyone else is wrong and they are right"...They have to come up with reasons why "NO BvS truly is a great movie, anyone who doesnt think so is clearly biased,corrupt and or paid off"
I love A ton of movies that are Universally agreed upon as being bad movies....for example I enjoy the hell out of the first 2 Transformers movies...
They are IMO good movies, Fun movies....but I absolutely understand my opinion is not shared by the majority....I do not go around saying "Screw Rotten tomatoes, Its so obvious RT is biased toward Transformers movies" I dont go around saying "I dont care that nearly 80% of the critics hated Transformers 2, They are all Wrong...I am right, Transformers 2 was great"
I am perfectly fine being in the minority...and excepting I just like a movie others dont...
I love most of the MCU films...But I hate IM3 and AOU...to me they are Extremely disappointing and It surprises they got good reviews....I feel they should have gotten much less favorable reviews....but that is my opinion...
I dont go around stating as a fact "IM3 and AOU were bad and disappointing movies"...I'm fine excepting that The Majority Liked these movies, I'm in the minority that I disliked them, I dont try to discredit websites, or claim everyone is wrong about the movies being good, and I'm right about them being bad.
DC fans cant do this, They are too jealousy and Too Angry about the success of Marvel Studious....
They can not except that the DCEU films are bad, have massively disappointed and have under performed, The unprecedented success of the MCU films have literally kinda drove them crazy where they cant live in a world where DCEU arent having the same success....and since the DCEU films are in NO WAY having MCU levels of su
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
I have only an interest in Civil War and Dr. Strange. Those were pretty good for what they are. IF [and I emphasize IF] only the MCU makes a movie with Silver Surfer and Galactus in the proper way... that'd be grand. Granted, most MCU movies are a "see once" affair for me [with the exception of those 2 I mentioned, I even got the DR Strange in blue ray just to see it in full HD glory; maybe I'll get the CW too, though not for now].
On the other hand, I sure would love a proper Green Lantern and Flash movie [the only 2 DC characters stories I once cared about]. Green Lantern could be the GotG for the DCEU and Flash something like the Dr. Strange as well.
What really destroyed any potential the DCEU could have - IMHO - was the "i'm so serious and mature and smart" attitude that not only fell flat, it was nonexistent. If I want that kind of movie I know where to look at, Superhero movies wouldn't come to mind if I wanted something more than just fun.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Superhero films can be more than just brainless popcorn flicks. I personally do not like this attitude people have towards condemning things being serious. That is not what determines if a movie is bad or not. It is the execution.
There are plenty of good serious dark comic book films. TDK trilogy, Sin City, Logan, X-men Days of Future Past. Even look in tv that is exactly what Marvel is doing. Daredevil and Jessica Jones are both very dark shows but are executed well. All those adaptions people had fun with despite them being dark.
Are there bad dark serious things yes. Jonah Hex, Ghost Rider, Man of Steel, BVS, and many others.
There are good and bad lighthearted movies as well.
So no I do not agree with that sentiment. I like variety not for everything to adopt the same approach.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
The problem is that both the DCEU fanatics, the usual Youtube commentators and Zach Snyder at the time tried to sell that "it's deep and philosophical" shtick that went no where.
Can the Superhero flicks have some sort of recognizable meaning? Yes. Watchmen does a good job at it. Does it mean they all must have it or smack their pseudo-intellectualism into the viewers face? No, no it does not. Neither do I like that.
Same thing happened with Prometheus: "oh, look at me, I'm so smart, I'm going to talk about creators and gods and all sorts of philosophical and theological stuff" and it fell flat on its nose [happened with BvS as well].
Nodding to something, doesn't make it smart nor intelligent [or interesting, for that matter]. It does, however, make it look like what it is: empty and pointless.
So no, I don't care for "dark... because it's dark... and serious... and edgy" when it has nothing new to say about something I'll easily find in droves somewhere else, in much deeper way and better represented.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
Watchmen was a bland piece of dull mediocre crap. All Snyder did was copy the comic book panel for panel. Outside of the comic tell me something that movie did that was new? The Dark Knight gave us something we had not seen in a comic book movie before. Illustrating that sometimes people deserve more than the truth.
Sometimes a lie is what is necessary in order to move forward. Watchmen tried to sell this same kind of thing. Thing is Dark Knight came before it did. The Dark Knight also did it way better. Watchmen got nowhere near the reception The Dark Knight did critically. In fact Watchmen comes nowhere close to any of Nolan's Batman movies critically. It is Zack Snyder the guy behind Man of Steel, BVS, and Justice League. The common denominator is he really is not that good of a director. All his movies are hollow.
The problem with Prometheus was the Alien franchise was never about being philosophical. It is a B movie made beautifully. The charm is in the simplicity. Alien is a slasher flick set in space. What makes it fresh is the creature design. The charm of the cast and lead Sigourney Weaver is undeniable as well.
Batman has always been a psychological, dark, and brooding character. Batman being a crime drama fits him just fine. Many of his great comic book stories have done that. Read Long Halloween or Dark Victory.
Dark Knight does not just nod to things neither does Logan. Logan gives us something the MCU has failed to do give closure. Introducing x-23 was awesome as well. A kid action hero we actually could take seriously and was not a joke. Hit girl was cool but it was more there for gags lets be honest. Nobody really took it seriously. Having the guts to kill off the main hero was great.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"Watchmen was a bland piece of dull mediocre crap."
I agree. It dragged needlessly to absurd measures. And that is the amount of "seriousness" in Superhero movies I'm willing to concede. After that, no more "serious" Superhero movies; thanks.
"Logan gives us something the MCU has failed to do give closure"
You do realize the MCU is not over yet, right? There is no closure when the franchise is still running. If there is closure to any character it will happen in Avengers 4 [Cap is going to kick the bucket one way or the other]
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[deleted]
7 years ago
That mentality is stupid. Oh so one movie did it therefore now we can't have serious superhero films anymore? So every movie needs to be tongue in cheek like most MCU movies? Why does that only apply to dark films? Someone could turn right back around and say okay after Guardians of the Galaxy no more light comedic comic book films.
The execution is what matters. There are good and bad in every genre. MCU themselves did Daredevil, Jessica Jones and Punisher. Those are dark, tv shows but still dark. Why is it no one moans about those? Because they are actually good. Batman Begins, The Dark Knight, The Dark Knight Rises, Sin City, X-men Days of Future Past, and Logan all are dark comic book movies. All well done though. There are duds just like in the lighthearted genre. Variety is good I do not want every superhero or comic book movie approached the same way.
MCU is not over. However guess what Logan beat them to the punch as far as killing off the main hero in a positively received way. I have not been impressed by a lot of MCU entries. There are some gems but the rest I find forgettable. Even though I recognize Civil War was well received I myself do not see the big appeal behind it.
It is good but it is visually boring, the effects while decent are nothing stellar and it does not stand alone. It is build up for the next outing. It feels like filler. Spider-man's cameo serves no purpose at all to the plot. It is fan service as well as advertisement for Spider-man homecoming. I found Winter Soldier, Guardians of the Galaxy and Iron Man to be better films.
Watchmen did the whole sometimes the lie is better than the truth angle. Guess what though The Dark Knight did it before them.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
"That mentality is stupid."
Again, you can't handle different opinions, snowflake. The internet is not for you.
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[deleted]
7 years ago
I can accept a disagreement when the point behind it is logical. Your points are not.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
You have no idea what "logic" is. Neither do you have a "point" other than being an internet idiot because you are some lonesome granny's cave dwelling troll. :)
I love you
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[deleted]
7 years ago
When someone jumps to calling someone a virgin like they are in 9th grade, it shows they lack maturity. Since you couldn't come against my points you then proceeded to attack my person, which you know nothing about. I attacked your grammar which was something I could see. I never attacked you personally, for all I know you could be an upstanding person. So not only am I more mature than you, I have way more logic than you ever will. Only those who have a 16 year old mentality view the term virgin as an insult.
What does someone's sex life have to do with if they are any more or less of a person? What if someone is asexual? What if they are a virgin by choice? I myself am not one but I have always found it hilarious when that is used as an insult. There is nothing wrong with being or not being a virgin. What matters is if you have good character.
I love you as well cupcake.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
^^^^ the whining continues. Don't miss the next episode. XD
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[deleted]
7 years ago
The ignorance will not ever stop.
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TwistedAcrobat (1725)
7 years ago
On the last Episode, Whining Timmy declared himself as being ignorant while knee jerking a comeback. BUT NOW, watch how Timmy will continue his desperate attention seeking on a brand new episode of TIMMYYYYYYYYYYY.
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