Telegraphing - Mr. Robot (2015) Discussion

[–] maxximilian 8 years ago

Did he say he was actually telegraphing something...like he was doing it on purpose. Or was it more like something he was doing unconsciously and finally noticed it himself?

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

No, that it's purposeful. He mentions it near the end of the talk, I'll go and look for the minute mark.

I edited my original post there to include it!

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[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 8 years ago

Yeah, and he doesn't give us a single THING! So it's really up to total speculation at this point.

One guess from the hip: Am I the only one that's wondered if there was going to be a Truman Show kind of thing going on? He already has us to talk to, but when if he's questioning everyone? What if, at some level, he believes that everything he's doing is being scrutinized, that he has an audience for it all ... something beyond just us.

I also liked, later on in the podcast, how he talks about Angela in the shoe store at the end of S1, and then references Jackie Brown in respect to hidden motivations.

Be sure to proof your posts to see if you any words out

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

Haha, of course he doesn't give us anything! We are never without our frustration 

Yeah, it is all speculative still, it just got me wondering about what more clearly could it be. Everyone digs so deep a lot of the time to create and analyze theories, but for all intents and purposes, it doesn't seem like Esmail meant to make it that tough. Challenging, sure, but strenuous...I'm not so sure. We're not seeing the forest through the trees, it appears, and him saying that kind of just brings that back to the forefront of my mind.

It was cool how they gave a shout out to Portia and that shoe scene, being the turning point for her as a character and in Portia's performance. I like that there does seem to be movies as companion pieces of each season, haha, however inadvertent that is.

I thought it was just a cool podcast, in general. Them allowing the show runner to discuss and respond to criticisms and such is something you don't really see/hear much of. Also, kudos to Esmail for being willing to do so. He seems to have a good balance of caring what the audience is saying, but also sticking to his guns on what his vision for the story is.

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[–] maxximilian 8 years ago

OK....first of many wild guesses. Price is Angela's biological father which is why he has taken her under his wing. White Rose has just told her this secret in the fish room. :D

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[–] Ghost0101 8 years ago

Elliott's mom is dead.

I'm 99% sure this is what he is referring to. Go back and watch the scene at the home, its obvious Elliott is talking to a grave of a person, not an actual person.

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[–] Nostrana 8 years ago

The mom did seem totally off. However, I recall an earlier episode flashback with Darlene and Elliot (the one with the Halloween movie) and they talk about their mom. Elliot asks her if she had heard from the mom, and Darlene said something that she had but that the mom was always was complaining about the deceased dad. That was set just about 7 months before the 5/9 hack. Didn't sound like she was dead if she talked to her on the phone.

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[–] Nanrad 8 years ago

No, she's in a nursing home. Since he hallucinated his mom, he hallucinated their interactions.

"And even with Will dead, the love triangle is not over."

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[–] Ghost0101 8 years ago

We don't know that to be true.

I'm not referring to his interactions with the mom at the jail.

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[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 8 years ago

Elliott's mom is dead.

I'm 99% sure this is what he is referring to. Go back and watch the scene at the home, its obvious Elliott is talking to a grave of a person, not an actual person.

Interesting. He did comment on how the clock was broken, but we can only speculate on what he meant on that point.

Be sure to proof your posts to see if you any words out

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[–] Orlando_Gardner 8 years ago

Not the only stopped clock either. What's up with Dom's digital clock always flashing on 12:00. Are ther other instances of stopped/broken time pieces? I can't remember season 1 that well.

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[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 8 years ago

Yeah, Dom's clock has been perpetually blinking 12:00.

I suppose that could be interpreted as different than a broken, or stuck clock. In this case, it's likely something she just hasn't bothered to set since a previous power outage.

And it's been that way since before the brown-outs, so it's probably not a case of being tired of constantly re-setting it.

I feel that it's connected somehow to Alexis, her trust or reliance on it that renders the standard alarm clock obsolete ... and yet she keeps it, still plugged in, still blinking 12:00.

Be sure to proof your posts to see if you any words out

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[–] nemo_on_acid 8 years ago

Dom's clock is stuck on 1:02 or 1:05 as well

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[–] Ghost0101 8 years ago

As I said, go back and watch the scene.

She says nothing, but the verbiage he uses makes it clear he is talking to her as if she is a grave. "You have really helped me get through these last few months", how can that possibly interpreted as something he would say to his live mom that he never talks to?

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[–] diamonddave247 8 years ago

The interviewer mentions something about "E-coin", and just then, it seems as though this jog's Esmail's memory and he is reminded of something he is "telegraphing", that viewers have not picked up on. Could it be something related to "E-coin"? Or perhaps something we should know about bitcoin in the real world, as well?! Whatever the case, Esmail's comment didn't strike me as though it was any sort of groundbreaking revelation about Mr. Robot, but more of a smaller detail viewers should have caught.

Then again, I'm terrible at solving mysteries. Wish I could be of more help.

.

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

It's true it did come after the E Coin thing, but you could also say it reminded him of whatever this may be because he was commending them for guessing that...so he was like, "speaking of catching onto things...this thing I'll keep totally vague!" haha

Another interesting thing is, and I wish he wasn't cut off, but right before he was it seemed like he was going to say, "and it's something people will say is a ch..." I assume he was going to say, "cheat." So, maybe it's something a lot of people would see as something too convenient or like a Deus Ex Machina.

I realize I could be making a mountain of a mole hill here, but all the other times he's referred to things as being telegraphed it's been in conjunction with one of the bigger reveals like Mr. Robot being a personality or Elliot in jail so...going by that track record.

Right now, I'm just trying to rack my brain for what could now be the most obvious or overlooked kind of thing. Maybe it is that it's all in Elliot's mind, but I feel like that theory is popular and out there enough Esmail would know about it enough to not tack on that he feels no one has picked up on it. I also just thought it was an intriguing moment in the podcast and bit of information about the show, and figured I'd share! Hmmmm. Curious-er!

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[–] diamonddave247 8 years ago

By the way, thanks for the link. I had never heard that podcast before, seems like an interesting channel. Although, their interview style with Esmail seemed a little "all over the place" to me. They would ask a question, then as you mentioned before, cut off his answer. Then go to another question before Esmail had fully explained his previous thought. They were also talking over each other. So, it was a little difficult to make out exactly what was being said. Overall though, it was a pretty good interview. I enjoyed it.

I was glad to hear Esmail state that the shooting of Elliot was an actual event, and not a dream. That helps a lot. I was still on the fence about it.

.

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

You're welcome! I thought it was a more interesting interview than usual with them being able to feel free to dive into criticisms and letting Esmail back those up or whatever. Like I said above, we don't get to hear that too often directly from the people involved or the head honcho. He seems to have a relationship with those two hosts (one did the after show) so I guess that allowed him to feel more open about things, but it was good to get his take now that the whole season is done.

I'm glad that he seemed to confirm a few things here and there too. I wouldn't say that's ever anything definitive as far as the entire series goes, but for now, it's nice to put those to bed juuuust for a little 

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[–] k_who 8 years ago

Well, if there is telegraphing, than I've always supposed it had something to do with Elliot, E-Corp, Esmail Corporation, E-coin, Land of Ecodelia, etc...

We have this automatically assumed idea that the Universe has existed for billions and billions of years, but, really, says who? May be I or you, we just imagined it a couple of hours ago. May be no time has passed at all. May be time is just the concept we imagined as well?

There is just no way to know. Yet. So it doesn't even really matter that much if that is what he is telegraphing.

I'm the only one that exists.

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[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 8 years ago

Well, if there is telegraphing, than I've always supposed it had something to do with Elliot, E-Corp, Esmail Corporation, E-coin, Land of Ecodelia, etc...

Exactly.

Eh?

Be sure to proof your posts to see if you any words out

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[–] maxximilian 8 years ago

Just a thought.....way out in left field. It's about Zhang/Whiterose. Now everybody knows they are the same person, both Dark Army leader and Minister of State Security. When giving a tour of his home to Dom, Zhang explains the dresses as belonging to his sister. I also seem to recall that Dom later points out that he has no sister...at least not that the FBI knows about. Also, as Whiterose, time is obsessively observed and can be explained that as his alter-ego, Zhang can't maintain it long. Ministers of state security can't go missing for long without being noticed.

Now...do we really know for sure that Zhang doesn't have a sister. A twin sister? Could he have been telling the truth? Has there been definitive evidence presented that a twin sister does not and cannot exist? Personally, I can't see the Chinese government losing track of the minister of state security for even a few seconds, let alone the time it takes to travel to the US for a meeting. And if Zhang arrived in the US as Zhang, he would be monitored 24/7 by US agents and can't see him slipping into a dress and out the back door of the hotel without notice.

So what if Zhang is telling the truth about a sister? I'm not pushing a theory so much as asking if absolute evidence of one person only is there and I missed it. For example, in the case of Tyrell being Elliot, you could just find a scene where both are present and both are acknowledged by a third party as different people. That happened in the first episode, BTW. Any scene that excludes an actual Zhang sister?

If not, could you imagine the bombshell scene in season 3 or 4 where Zhang is sitting in a room, and in through the door...his sister, Whiterose, walks in. Then your head kinda explodes? LOL :D

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[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] llienomit 8 years ago

I'll lob this out there, with no idea if its been heaved into the pit before.
..That the Elliot we know, is not the original/real or at least previous representation of Elliot. This Elliot is new.

Having gone back and rewatched S1. Something I recalled from prior was.. whats up with Elliots memory? He forgets Darlene, and his Dads image at least. Specifically he tells us he can 're program' his perspective [E corp to Evil]. He's alone, yet has Darlene, and Angela. The photograph of his family goes from he and mom to the whole family over the course of S1. 'You're not Elliot your the...' [Monster, Mask?]. 'You're only a month' old comes up twice. Us or him? Did the base Elliot lose his memory? Is this Elliot just a representation of base Elliot, with gaps being filed in as we journey forward. I feel that there may be some other layer to Elliot, beyond Mr R and the Elliot we see. At the very least something [maybe donning the mask] caused Elliot to lose his memory of several things, or shift his programming to "forget" those things. They have yet to absolutely show what that event was.

---Listen, ..do you smell something?---

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

Are you suggesting that the Elliot we know is just a construct of the real Elliot, that he's forgotten?

I suppose it's not too far-fetched to wonder if the Elliot we know isn't true or if he's been lying to us more than we know. After the whole prison thing we know just how capable and to what extent, he is, of doing just that. We believe him because he's made such a personal connection to us and is our doorway into this world, but perhaps, we should be even more weary of that than we are.

Personally, I don't know how happy I'd be if Elliot ended up being some out and out, awful, villain...but at this point, where he is with Mr. Robot, I wouldn't be surprised if we get an even darker Elliot than we've seen so far. Ya know he's clued in more to things that are going on, his relationships have been shaken up, not to mention he's been shot, and Mr. Robot has revealed himself (yet again) to be even worse than he thought...he's not naive to this world anymore, and is aware that it's him really doing all of this, so him taking a darker turn would make sense. I suppose it depends on what that darkness is and if he will be or can be redeemed of it. As a whole, the masses love a good comeback haha. Or maybe Mr. Robot will end up winning in the end (don don donnnn). Still when the ashes settle, it'd be nice if we were able to see some semblance of the Elliot we know still lingering in there somewhere, even if it's faint. Maybe I'm just a sap or too attached, though!

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[–] llienomit 8 years ago

Just spitballin for the most part. But something happened prior to us being brought in.

More or less the Elliot we see is a representation. Is it he or He/Us thats only a month old? He has certainly forgotten/re-programmed a lot. How/Why/ To what end? What caused this fracture, and then to lose so much of his past? Why would Elliot need to forget the past, or the current for that matter?

I feel that as long as Elliot/MrR doesn't or hasn't [intentionally] killed anyone, then I personally think I can accept what he was/is/has become.

---Listen, ..do you smell something?---

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

I suppose outside the familial drama and window push, I just accepted that as his mental illness and that's the reason for it. I didn't think their needed to be something else along with that, but there's always more we don't know. That should just be the subtitle of the show! Mr. Robot ; There's Always Something More You Guys Don't Know haha

I suppose it just opens up a Pandora's Box (or should it be an Alderson Box?) of questions. Who is the real Elliot then? Is the one we know just a show, of sorts? Which is the one he truly sees himself as? Has this all been a manipulation of Mr. Robot's on us?I'd hate to think all of his better qualities are fake or a put on, but once you wonder about the nature of the person we've come to know as Elliot, there's a whole identity crisis that could come into play for the audience too. I can understand the want to use that or to play around with that since it's compelling. To rope us in with sympathies only to end up making us complicit in some horrible person's game.

Again, I don't know how down I'd be for that, but I also could see something like it kind of happening. I don't need to have super likable characters or anything like that, but it'd be nice to still be able to root for the Elliot that's (maybe) underneath.

By the by, I haven't watched any of s1 in a little bit, do you know the exact wording Elliot uses about rebooting his mind or hacking it or whatever that led to his forgetting/selective wipe down of his past or the his life leading up to when he "created" us?

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[–] llienomit 8 years ago

Eps 1 & 4 have a lot of it. Ep1 tells us he re-programs himself to see E as Evil, and that 'krista would be pissed if she knew'. Ep 1 has one mention of being a month old but it's seemingly directed at us. Ep 4 has the funky dream with Qwerty the fish filet dinner. In that sequence Elliot is represented as a month old and "You're not even Elliot you are the ...." So what is Elliot, the mask, the monster? I'd suggest rewatching at least 1-4 or just redo the the whole batch. Something happened to Elliot that made him forget, fracture, or both, and it happened right before we climbed aboard as the backpack viewer.

---Listen, ..do you smell something?---

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[–] Dreamers_x_Disease 8 years ago

I've rewatched them it's just been a while since I did that, I recall the Daemons drug dream well enough so I got all the ones you pointed out with that. So, I guess it's time for a total run through, perhaps!

I can't say I ever asked myself what made him this way outside of the obvious illnesses and traumas he's had, but it's always good to question oneself about this show haha so I'll keep that in mind whenever I get around to that rewatch (or really re-rewatch). Thanks for including those examples!

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[–] Nostrana 8 years ago

I'll lob this out there, with no idea if its been heaved into the pit before.
..That the Elliot we know, is not the original/real or at least previous representation of Elliot. This Elliot is new.

I seriously think you may be on to something with this. Things did seem to start changing for Elliott after Darlene returned to town when she showed up at his apartment at Halloween. He put on his dad's Mr Robot jacket from his closet and Darlene gave him the mask to wear. At that point he started talking about taking the job at Allsafe and changing the world. Also we know Angela has been telling Elliot that they "don't talk any more" and that she misses "us". Angela also told Darlene (during the scene when they searched for him at the Queens museum) that strangely Darlene hadn't been heard of much or in Elliot's life until recent. In sum, it does seem like that Halloween visit with Darlene and Elliot putting on the jacket and mask, seem to create a new spark, and perhaps simultaneously caused a memory lapse.

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[–] llienomit 8 years ago

Dates. Dates are important. I recall seeing one in either the first or second ep, on Lloyds system. It was an online purchase, and the date was Nov17th I believe. I recall on my rewatch noticing it, and stopping zooming to see that date. Correlate that with Halloween. Oct 31st. This would seem to imply 'something' happened between Oct31 to Nov17th. As Elliot definitely still knew who Darlene was if he's visiting her pad and try's the mask on for Halloween. Then over the next two weeks something happens to his memory. Another note is that Angela never falls outside his awareness. She is always noted as his childhood friend from Ep1 on.

---Listen, ..do you smell something?---

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[–] Nostrana 8 years ago

I rewatched S2E4 with the flashback Halloween scene, and there may have been some memory issues prior to Halloween. Elliot tells Darlene that he lost his job at Infosec due to an incident when he kept the staff at work during the holiday Memorial Weekend, and he woke up with no memories of the previous 24 hours. The servers were all trashed and he was blamed for it, though he had no memory.

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[–] llienomit 8 years ago

I agree, and between Darlenes apt/the mask, a couple/few weeks later he loses recollection of who Darlene is. In effect not only losing memory of a moment [trashing servers], but a huge segment of his past[Dad, & Darlene]. They have not shown us how/why Elliot loses those family memories, but I imagine it is significant.

---Listen, ..do you smell something?---

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[–] contrastingcontradiction 8 years ago

Check out this link ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdG4cG9n9XM

The theory is that Mr Robot is a metaphor for cancer, with each season progressing through the various "stages" ... Season 2 was stage 2 cancer. It makes sense since both Angela and Elliot's parents died of cancer.

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