Budapest?
Does anyone know why this movie took place in Budapest? I was just wondering...
shareI suppose the simplest answer is, why not?
In actuality it's probably because the film is an adaptation of a play by a Hungarian.
MovieChat Forums > The Shop Around the Corner (1940) Discussion > Budapest?
For personal nostalgic reasons. Everyone, at the time, wondered why he chose Budapest instead of some town in America. But Ernst Lubitsch wanted to recreate memories of that place from his youth.
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I thought it was kind of weird too - especially since, except for the "penga" instead of dollars, and the signage, you'd think it took place in New York, or any American city. Most of the characters are white, english speaking American types. There's no "hey, what are you doing in Budapest? I'm here because...".
Not that it made a huge difference, but it had me scratching my head too cannonli83.
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
LOL I think they spoke English so that you could understand it!
But seriously, why shouldn't a story about a Budapest shop be set in a Budapest shop? Moviegoing would be pretty dull if every movie was set in the USA. And why should you expect Hungarians to be different from Americans? People are people, and many American people and cities have Central European heritage.
Haha, yeah, I know they have to speak English - I'm just saying, if you really want me to think this is Budapest, why not have some people in the background - in the street scenes, or in the diner, speaking Hungarian?
Like I said, it didn't really bother me that it was set in Budapest, it just had me scratching my head, because there didn't seem to be any reason for it to be set in Budapest, you know?
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
It took place in Budapest, because it is where the original hungarian play is set. They just filmed a direct tranlation of the play.
shareYeah, I know that. I get that. I don't think you understand what I'm saying.
Lots of movies are based on scripts/books/plays set in foreign locations, but more often than not in Hollywood, they change the location to an American one, to make it more relatable for the American audience (unless the foreign location is integral to the story).
The Budapest location was in no way integral to the story here. So one simply wonders, why didn't they make it an American city? It's nice for the author of the play that they kept the original setting, it's just a little odd that they did, that's all. Especially since they didn't go out of their way to let the audience know that it was Budapest, which made the "penga" a little confusing at first. Then you notice the signage is foreign, and it starts to make sense.
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
Location is an important subject in Lubitsch pictures. Lubitsch was attracted to the play's Old World Sensibilities, and its time period in 1920s.
And there are also personal things.
The Shop around the corner in Budapest reminded Lubitsch of his father's clothing store in Berlin. Lubitsch found the atmosphere of the shop in Budapest very similar to his father's clothing store in Berlin. Like Berlin, Budapest was a center to Old World Sensibilities.
But Major American Cities were more advanced compared to the cities like Budapest and Berlin. So they weren't a center to Old World Sensibilities.
Also of course they may not have had the rights to change it. Some times copyright clearence is only granted if changes are not made (apart obviously from translation).
shareof course there is an American centred version called In the Good Old Summertime with Judy Garland (it is a musical version, but much of the dialog is the same, this time the shop is a music store
shareI think the reason is that it's hearkening back to the Mitteleuropa tradition of the Broadway operetta as done in 1900-1920.
shareYou may not even check this . . by now, but I whole heartedly agree, Cathy.
What were they thinking? it kinda threw me off as well. Being so much like NYC and then the signs were in another language. Whatever! You're not alone! Jean
Haha, thanks Jean! :)
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
why not budapest for a change, the world doesn't revolve around America you know,
I think it was a brave move to leave it in Hungary.
it seems that all too ofter you have to change the location to america or put in an american actor to make it 'profitable' in the USA.
I'm just saying, if you really want me to think this is Budapest, why not have some people in the background - in the street scenes, or in the diner, speaking Hungarian?
That would be scary, believe me - because it would make Matuschek & Co. look like a bunch of American agents or something... ;-)
Seriously, though, you won't find that kind of realism even in today's Hollywood (because "funny accents" are NOT the same as properly speaking in tongues ;).
In fact, I was quite surprised to see that the "shop" signs and other inscriptions were actually in Hungarian.
On the other hand, I was also surprised by the fact that practically no surname is Hungarian: with the exception of Vadas (and maybe some other name, I don't remember), they are all Czech and Slovak surnames. (And Hungarian is not even distantly related to the Czech or Slovak language, so the names are not similar at all.)
I think it was wise of Lubitsch to make it look, as you say, as if it were happening in any American town. Too much "exoticism" may have not fared too well with the average American cinema-goer of the era.
I think Lubitsch chose Budapest - or rather, kept the Hungarian writer's setting - because he wanted to "recreate" - or at least pay a "hommage" to - the golden era of Austria-Hungary (even though at the time there was no more Austria-Hungary, but many people still reminisced nostalgically about it).
He could've chosen Vienna - but with so many Viennese in Hollywood, I can imagine the idea of Vienna was beginning to grow a beard... ;)
share
It's a translation convention, a narrative device. The characters are Hungarians speaking Hungarian, you're hearing English from English-speaking actors because it's a film for an English-speaking audience. It's not that hard to work out.
"It's that kind of idiocy that I empathize with." ~David Bowie
People are people, and many American people and cities have Central European heritage.
Yes people are people but they don't all behave the same way in different countries. Americans don't act like Europeans and vise versa.
I think people are missing the OP point people in Budapest don't have American accents and even people in the U.S. don't act the same some things in the U.S. are regional, and a lot of adaptations get relocated to fit the country. None of the actors used accents that you would find in Budapest which they could have done and still spoke English.
I don't know if it would have worked but none of the Germans on "Hogan's Heroes" spoke German but they all used German accents, and on the series "'Allo 'Allo!" all the characters spoke English except they used accents based on the countries where the characters were from on the series the French characters spoke English with French accents, and when a character spoke to another character who wasn't from their country they would switch to the accent of the character they were conversing e.g. the French operative would switch to a British accent and English when talking to the two British soldiers. "'Allo 'Allo!" was on the air for 10 years.
The 1998 film "You've Got Mail" is based on the same play "Parfumerie" by Miklós László as was "The Shop Around the Corner".
Minds that have withered into psychosis are far more terrifying than any character of fiction. share
If they were going to make it for an American audience with American actors and then set it in Budapest, shouldn't the actors have at least tried to use Hungarian accents? Stewart sounded completely out of place.
I think of a film like Hester Street where the actors at least tried to emulate the accents of Jewish emigres living in NYC at a certain point in time.
This film just feels like some weird hybrid, neither fish nor fowl.
Get me a bromide! And put some gin in it!
Why would people living in Budapest have accents? If we are to imagine they were talking Hungarian to each other then they shouldn't have any accents.
shareWhy would people living in Budapest have accents? If we are to imagine they were talking Hungarian to each other then they shouldn't have any accents.
Because they're in Hungary. The film was done this way because this is how they did things in Hollywood at that time, they don't do it like that now if the film were done now the people may use English but they would have them using Hungarian accents.
Like I stated earlier both "Hogan's Heroes" and "'Allo'Allo" were made for English speaking audiences and the characters used accents
None of the German soldiers in "Casablanca" spoke with a German accent, and neither did the French or Italian soldiers.
When they did "Judgment at Nuremberg" which was made for American audiences the European characters spoke English but used accents, I'm pretty sure Montgomery Clift spoke with a German accent in real life or in most of his films. He was born in Omaha, and in most of his films he sounded like he was from the east coast he may have picked up a new york accent from living in New York doing theatre.
I think it was just a sign of the times, as I stated they would either have the actors use accents or speak the language of the characters' country.
the series "The Americans" is made for an American audience airs on F/X and the Russian characters in the Russian embassy speak Russian and they use subtitles the Russina agents use American accents speak English unless they're talking to their contact in the Russian embassy.
If they were talking in English people would be wondering why Russian embassy personnel are speaking English in the embassy.
If the series had been done in the past yes the actors would all be speaking American English and most likely using American accents.
I don't expect to see this attention to detail in older films, and i don't think people in 1940s America would ask these questions almost all movies were made in Hollywood so Anglicizing everything was perfectly normal.
TCM aired "Gigi" earlier today and it was made for an American audience and all the actors used their natural French accents although some of them had British accents, Leslie Caron was born in France but she had lost her French accent while she was living in the UK. That film did very well but it was done years later.
Minds that have withered into psychosis are far more terrifying than any character of fiction. share
"Because they're in Hungary. The film was done this way because this is how they did things in Hollywood at that time, they don't do it like that now if the film were done now the people may use English but they would have them using Hungarian accents. "
You seemed to have completely missed my point. Having them talk with accents is stupid. People have accents when they are speaking a foreign language NOT when they are speaking their own language. I am glad they didn't have them speak with fake accents.
As for how it is done now it depends on the director.
You seemed to have completely missed my point. Having them talk with accents is stupid. People have accents when they are speaking a foreign language NOT when they are speaking their own language. I am glad they didn't have them speak with fake accents.
As for how it is done now it depends on the director.
I didn't miss anything, and it's doesn't depend on the director find me a modern day film set in another country where they speak with American accents. That's stupid.
A good actor can do an accent without you knowing it's fake besides both Felix Bressart and Joseph Schildkraut used accents and it didn't seem to bother anyone.
Ironically the two other films had the good sense to set the films in America where it made perfect sense for the actors to speak with American accents "In the Good Old Summertime" and "You've Got Mail" which like this film were based on the Miklós László's play "Parfumerie". It didn't have anything to do with the directors it just made common sense, the films were aimed at American audiences so why set them in Budapest and have people talking and acting like Americans?
Case in point a few years ago i was listening to the radio and for some reason this topic came up and caller after made fun of the fact that a lot of the actors in the "Ten Commandments" spoke with east coast accents Edward G. Robinson seem to be the butt of most of the jokes because he delivered his lines as if he were talking in one of his gangster films.
You must be one of the Anglophiles everything has to be in English and the actors all need to speak English or have American accents. I know there are still some people who think this way i use to work with one, she didn't like foreign films because the people didn't speak or sound American. Go figure.
The film "Biko" was aimed at an American audience but i don't recall Denzel Washington and any of the other casts talking with American accents. Although you must really like Kevin Costner as Robin Hood he made no attempt to do an accent i guess he looked at the project the same way you, it's aimed at Americans so why do a British accent for a character from British folklore?
The interesting thing is Errol Flynn was Australian and he didn't do the role with his natural Australian accent and the film was aimed at Americans. yeah and that's another film that the people on the radio picked on because some of the supporting characters spoke with east coast accents.
If you don't believe about people making fun of actors not using accents for their region where the film is taking place, even Billy Crystal did an entire routine making fun of Edward g. Robinson's gangster accent in the "Ten Commandments" his most famous line in his all American gangster accent "Where's your Messiah now? LOL ~ http://bit.ly/1eChKvl
Probably for the same reason many comedians who do voice imitations do Jimmy Stewart's mid-western drawl which he had in this film.
"Where's your Messiah now? ~ http://bit.ly/1eChKvl share
Yes, I also constantly mention the name of the city I live in, in every coversation I have with fellow citizens. And I've been to Budapest and you're right, people over there are mostly black and Asian, there are hardly any white folks.
Seriously, the movie felt "exotic" enough to understand that it didn't take place in the US. More obvious clues just weren't necessary. Like you said yourself, the location is not integral to the story, so why emphasize it or change it? The director set the movie in Budapest to retain the charm and authenticity of the play. It would be boring if everything would be set in the same place. It's not only "nice" to the author, it's also nice to me, I like some variation. And like someone else said, people are people. What makes you think Hungarians were that much different from Americans? As for characters in the background speaking the original language, I always found that to be stupid. The English spoken is supposed to be a translation, this narrative device doesn't work unless ALL characters speak English.
Yes, I also constantly mention the name of the city I live in, in every coversation I have with fellow citizens. And I've been to Budapest and you're right, people over there are mostly black and Asian, there are hardly any white folks.
Hahaha, that was my reaction, too!
*****
We are doomed. share
David Traversa. CathyE: "You'd think it took place in New York, or any American city. Most of the characters are white...", well I'll be damned..., I didn't know North America was lily white...
Haha, touche davidtraversa - 1, but I was taking into consideration this was filmed in 1940.
Cheers.
Cathy.
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
David Traversa. CathyE: You floored me with your answer, why? because I was almost sure you were a nasty type of person that would react badly to my comment and yet your answer shows me an open personality (you laughed at my observation about open racism and accepted it with humour and debonair, attributes that only very intelligent people posses. Keep up that attitude Cathy!! Best, David
P.S: Did you see "Auntie Mame"-1958, with Rosalind Russell? Remember the spoiled, snobbish bride of her nephew that Mame couldn't stand? OK, when I read that line in your original comment I pictured you similar to that kind of person.
Fortunately you turned out to be more like Auntie Mame.
:)
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
Well, the story is about a Budapest shop so why shouldn't it be set in Budapest? Moviegoing would be pretty dull if every movie was set in the America. Also, the writer of the play was Hungarian and maybe the movie studio may not have had the rights to change it.
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"I wish I had a million dollars...HOT DOG!" - George Bailey
Aside from the fact that the original play takes place in Budapest, there's a certain quaintness and charm and, as one reader calls it, "Old World sensibility" or Old World charm, which the industrial age had nearly destroyed in America, so that the traditional base-level values this film references wouldn't have carried very well in an American shop in an American city.
. . . . . . . .
I think everyone is missing the point of Cathy's post. It's fine that it takes place in Budapest (and I'm sure Cathy gets the history of the material), but it just doesn't appear Hungarian "enough" (with the English and the American cast) so what's the point of saying it's Budapest at all? They should've at least had the set and the extras "more" Hungarian or explained the location somehow, otherwise, plonking down a bunch of Americans in a random city seems... well, random. (As an example, having Casablanca set in Morocco [with Paris flashbacks!] doesn't seem so out of left field, because the story dictates the location.)
Right, Cathy?
BTW, I agree. :) Still love this film, though, and obviously our little "annoyances" with it don't prevent us from adoring it and watching it repeatedly, not to mention the fact that it was made 60+ years ago and people are still "into" it, so who cares?
I'm sort of making myself wait to watch it until next month, but oh, it's difficult. (I know, I'm weird.)
Having never seen this film before this past weekend, I
was surprised to find that it takes place in Budapest.
It seemed incongruous given the Americans in the cast
as well as the cars and clothing which all seem like
the 40's but not European. A thought occurred while
watching that the characters were Americans who went to
Europe to work, especially when the story mentions "perga"
in any form instead of dollars. I understand now why it
is set there, but I still find it rather strange.
"...it could be like this, just like this, always..." Jack Twist
Right lara jane :)
“I always tell the truth…even when I lie” - Scarface
There are 3 reasons:
the first, and more important is that, all along the movie they talk about the serious economical crisis in the counry. Klara Novak is unemployed at the start of the play, Kralik is feered of loosing his job because is very hard to find another one. I think that Lubitsch thoughts it was better to do not make any relation between the economical situation of USA and the economical crisis cited in the movie.
The second reason, i think is functional to the plot: to set the movie in an "exotic" town in Europe helps giving to the film a sort of "fairy tale" atmosfere. in the '30 and '40 only few americans (and just the upper classes ones) were able to afford a travel in europe, the to talk about budapest was a little bit like talk about an almost unreachable place...
The third reason i think is a political one: something like to say that love is love anywhere, from USA to UErope, the feeling and the human are always the same. Considering the period the movie was filmed, this message had some social and political implications.
Two things struck me about this movie. The first was that although it was an American cast, almost everyone (especially Frank Morgan as Mr. Matuschek) affected a pseudo-Eastern European accent. Except for Jimmy Stewart, who still sounded like plain ol' Jimmy Stewart from Indiana, Pennsylvania.
The second thing that struck me was that four years after this movie was made, Jimmy Stewart was dropping bombs on that part of the world. I don't recall if he actually flew any missions to Budapest or elsewhere in Hungary, but if he didn't, a bunch of other B-24 and B-17 pilots just like him did, and he was bombing other Nazi-occupied cities!
Oh, the fickle finger of fate and the fortunes of war!