what a cold hearted b itch! abandon your family, disappear for 2 years, and then come back and say "ok im ready to be a mother again", and then get away with it too?! god, i just wanted to kill her!! poor dustin hoffman... lost his wife, lost his job, then the icing on the cake, lost his custody battle, and almost lost his kid... what a depressing movie this was... great movie, but depressing...
shareIt's called depression. Know what that's like?
Would you rather she left him so she could heal, or stayed with him and eventually commit suicide?
Depression is not something to be taken lightly. Joanna was mentally ill and in desperate need of psychiatric help. She was in no condition to be a mother, and she knew it.
Agreed and agreed, but the point is, Joanna ran off to --- California!?!?! Granted, therapists were regarded as more socially progressive out there, but by 1979 in a hugely cosmopolitan place like NYC, surely she could have found a helpful shrink and all the meds she might have required.
The only explanation I can think of for her long-distance abandonment to the west coast rather than to Boston was that her folks were out there (retired or whatever), otherwise, how could she have made it initially with no income or anything new on her resume for 7 years? Perhaps CA was not as expensive to live in the 1970s, but I can't picture Joanna living in some slum and then trying to pay for therapy on top of that. Even a best friend from college, if that's who she stayed with, could only offer so much financial help.
That was another oddball thing about this movie.... Ted & Joanna seemed to be like orphans or something, with no grandparents, siblings, nobody else to add input to their situation outside of neighbor Margaret. Heck, Ted simply came from Brooklyn, and he only in his 30s at most, surely one or both of his parents could still have been alive. Of course this would have complicated the story but divorce, like marriage, messes up more than the principals, and a custody case would certainly be the dominant topic at family gatherings--- which neither Ted nor Joanna appeared to have ever participated. Good movie, good story, but strangely incomplete.
"Shake me up, Judy!"
I have to agree with the original poster. ALthough I do understand she had to do what was best for her own mental health so she did need to go through therapy and all that. The main problem I have is the way she left. She didn't even try to explain it to the kid. It was like she left him hung out to dry. Ofcourse kids always blame themselves when parents split up because they don't know that adults have their own issues to deal with. she let the kid go on feeling totally abandoned. She can watch from across the street but she can't go see the kid in all that time??? And let's talk about that stupid note she wrote to the kid. now THAT made me wanna choke her when I heard the note. Especially those parts where she said she needed to go find something more interesting in life and there's more to life than being a mother. No wonder the kid put the picture in the drawer, he should've thrown it out the window. While all this is going on she's off worrying about her career and her new boyfriend, but never bothered to even call or visit.
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I will probably catch all kinds of grief for this but I was not at all impressed by Meryl Streep's acting in "Kramer vs. Kramer". Even when I first saw the movie in the theatre in 1979 (yes, I am that old) it seemed to me that all she did was whine and cry. That's the only reason why I'd want to choke Ms Meryl in this movie.
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i felt the exact same way, how could anyone be so selfish, no matter how you feel, whether you're feeling down or whether you're dying inside your child comes first, if you don't understand that you shouldn't be a mother full stop.
sharePeople really hated her that much? I hardly hated her. I wasn't happy with what she did, but the film also did a great job of making it clear that we did not really glimpse into her side of the story. I felt for both of the characters, Hoffman more. Then Streep comes around in the end and the audience should realize that she is actually a good person and was really trying to find out what was best for her.
shareLOL. I didn't wanna choke her. Slap her maybe, but not choke her.
I felt so let down by the ending. While I can't understand how ANYONE can just take off and leave their child, I really tried to understand how she was feeling when she left. When she returned for the child, that made perfect sense to me. Then at the end, after she'd won custody and went to get the child... When she said to Hoffman something like, "I came to take him home. Then I realised he is home," I was saying "no no no no nooooooo no no..." I wanted to scream at that woman...until I realised that she wouldn't have been able to hear me, lol. I couldn't believe it. I just could not believe it. After all of that, that emotional journey and she decides she doesn't want the kid after all.
I just wondered if her character would ever be happy.
That's NUMBERWAAAAAANG!!!!!!!!!
Like others, I agree that Streep's character needed some serious help. I don't think she was leaving so much to "find herself" as much as she was about to have a nervous breakdown.
But then I can't help thinking... There IS a way to leave without traumatizing your son! You can stay in the city, see your kid, call your kid, tell your husband what you're doing, get some friends/family members involved...
I can see why a person about to have a breakdown would not be able to think through all that. But surely her therapist might have been able to help her try to make amends? I can't help thinking that she might have been able to at least call, visit, speak to her child and ex about what was happening, etc. after a while (and not eighteen full months). If it really took her 18 months to gather the courage to just see her son, then I have a hard time believing that she was already healed enough to have been a fit mother.
I would have understood the judge's ruling more if he would have first allowed supervised visits, or temporary custody, and/or family therapy. I can't imagine that someone can just reappear after nearly complete absence of 1.5 years and then expect to become a full-time parent. It would not have been good for her or the child - she might have had another breakdown. I'm surprised she was even able to handle the stress of the trial given the fact that she had apparently not been very emotionally stable for very long.
I can't say that I would have choked her because I don't think she was a bad person - I think she was ill and at the verge of a nervous breakdown.
That said... There IS a way to leave without traumatizing your son! You can stay in the city, see your kid, call your kid, tell your husband what you're doing, get some friends/family members involved, etc. I can see why a person about to have a breakdown would not be able to think through all that. But surely her therapist might have been able to help her try to make amends after a while? With help wouldn't she have been able to call, visit, speak to her child, move back to the East Coast, take her son out, etc.? If it really took her 18 months to be strong enough to see her son, then wouldn't it take several more months for her to be strong enough to become a full-time parent again? If she had only be stable for such a short amount of time, maybe the responsibility of a child would have overwhelmed her again and she would have had another breakdown. Personally she seemed to still be too fragile to handle the stress of the trial.
It would have been best for everyone if the judge would have first allowed supervised visits, then maybe increased it to joint custody, etc.
I wasn't a huge fan of Streep's charater. I get that she was unhappy and troubled and probably did need a break to get help. What I didn't like was her assumption that she could just walk back in and get full custody of their son. I don't think she 100% grasped how what she did affected her ex and their son and how much they had bonded in her absence.
Although I have to say I loved her decision at the end and if all child custody disputes were resolved this way kids would be a lot better off. In the end both characters behaved like adults.
The fact that you wanted to choke her, proves how good of an actress she is.
"Meryl Streep Is Nominated For 2 Golden Globes! Keep 'Em Coming!"
I had the EXACT same thread title in mind. I come here and see it's already here! I couldn't stand seeing that *beep* watching like a real creep from the coffee shop. Anyway she redeemed herself.
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