MovieChat Forums > Escape from L.A. (1996) Discussion > For Those That Fail To Understand This F...

For Those That Fail To Understand This Film and J Carpenter--READ THIS


It truly is a travesty that this film was not appreciated for what it was, but then again, to appreciate it, you'd have to UNDERSTAND it first, which for many, wasnt possible, as sadly, most tend to look for the external eye candy, glimmer and glitz of HW today, rather than for what a film's deeper meaning is and the message the director is trying to broadcast through the use of allegory and the proverbial 'peeling back of the onion layers.'

Yes, Escape from NY and LA will not 'wow' you with amazing special effects and action of Aliens, T2, etc. But most of John Carpenter's films have never focused on any of this, because that is not where his heart, mind and soul are placed. You see, you wont find Carpenter doing interviews for Time, Esquire, GQ, or on your normal mainstream news show being interviewed by some generic movie pundit about his next movie, or have the enormous marketing campaigns and fanfare that a Cameron or Spielberg movie would have. And there is a reason for that...

Many of his films focus on political and societal issues, and the schisms within our world, the main one being freedom vs tyranny, and those trying to break out of the current matrix, or those awaking to it and understanding that all is NOT what it seems. People aren't what they seem, government isn't what it seems, laws aren't what they seem, and mankind isn't fulfilling its rightful place as it was intended, due to those who crave power and the corruption that comes with it. Carpenter made this film in 1996, which takes place in 2013, and to blatantly ignore or not even understand how our world is quickly becoming the world depicted in the film (and its prequel), well, all i can say is you need to wake up and brush up on some history, my friends.

Carpenter, in my opinion, is a genius and an obvious historian, due to the fact he was able to use the smallest remnants 30 years ago, and depict them in his films in a wider light, which is now, as i said, coming to fruition. However, the mainstream HW sector wont smile too deeply upon the messages in Carpenter's film, and the reason being for that, is because most of the HW elite support the dystopic things going on today, either inadvertently, ignorantly, or willfully. We live in a very compartmentalized world today, and equally polarized; very divided, with many unable to just admit and accept what is going on. After all, John Carpenter always wanted to do a sequel to The Thing, truly one of best conceptual and unique sci-fi thrillers ever made, and Paramount had said that they would green light it, only on the condition of the success of Escape from LA. Well, we all know how that turned out. But to base the production of a movie on the success of another, which is about something COMPLETELY different, is just utterly ridiculous, but that is HW for you. However, on a side note, i did enjoy the sequel (well, prequel, actually) to The Thing, known as The Thing 2011, and i must say, it was VERY well done and i think John was proud of it. It didnt use any overly done and watered down elements that HW tends to use, ie, a hot babe gussied up with perfect hair and make-up (although the lead girl in the film was very cute) with a love interest, having time to sex it up and talk about general nonsense when they are facing imminent death; cheesy overly done HW puns and humor; and other bastardizations. The special effects and CGI were extremely well done, and didnt detract from the film, and wow, they really did great with tying up all the mysteries and links to what happened with the Norwegians. The fanboys putting it down, well, they just want perfection, or wanted Carpenter to do it, or have it be exactly like the first. Get over it, sheesh. The movie was fine and i felt they did an awesome job, even paying homage nicely to the first film.

But back to the main issue here. What are the analogies in this film, compared to the real world, you may ask? Well, allow me to give you a quick run down of this (to name them all, would lag the internet once i posted it). Half of our Bill of Rights is destroyed, our Constitution used as toilet paper today, by both the Left and Right and by virtually all Presidents since JFK's death, which was the start of America's decline, socially, morally and culturally. That whole L/R dichotomy is an illusion anyway, that people seriously need to wake up to. It is nothing more than a Skinner box, used to make you think you have a choice. 'Wars' are declared unjustly, with no congressional authority anymore. Lies and outright fabrications are used to start them (ahem, Iraq), cough, Libya). 'Laws' are created like the loving 'patriot act' and 'the federal grounds and improvement act', to name just a few of a hundred, which arent patriotic whatsoever (kills the 4th amendment) and improve nothing (kills the 1st amendment). We have war crimes taking place endlessly, whistleblowers and journalists demonized, spied on and harassed if they dare oppose the status quo's policies. We have an out-of-control Dept of Homeland Insecurity, which writes up numerous papers on demonizing veterans, Christians, anti-abortionists and other patriots as being 'terrorists.' (This was also the plan for this disgusting bureaucracy anyway, no different than what Hitler and Stalin did...after some time goes by, its simply turned on the people it was supposed to protect). DHS and other federal agencies give millions of our tax dollars to federalize and militarize our local police now, with Mine-Resistant Trucks, drones, and other military hardware and gear that looks ripped right out of Cobra Command from the GI Joe cartoons of the 80s. Notice the garbs, attitudes and characters of the USPF in this film. Uh huh, that's what i thought.

Basically, many local police today, walk around looking like the police state slugs you seen in both Carpenter's 'Escape' movies. DHS has recently purchased over 2bn rounds of ammo, the Army itself has bought non-NATO ammo now, the 7.62mm AK-47 rounds (18mn mags of them) which they NEVER bought before, as its non-standard. DHS is the umbrella now too, for ICE, CBP, TSA, VIPR and FEMA. I thought FEMA was supposed to be an emergency and disaster agency? Why is it under 'homeland security'? Yep, ask yourself that one. DHS also has its own Army Brigade too, known as Homeland Brigade. This is a domestic agency with a military wing? Uh huh. Then we have the recent NSA spying apparatus and all the leaks by Edward Snowden where that is concerned, and in short, is basically spying on not just us, but the WHOLE WORLD. There is the IRS scandal too from months ago, which was obviously engineered right from the top as the evidence now shows in even mainstream news outlets now, but ofc, the congress is too spineless to push it that far and just tends to sweep it under the rug. Oh and lets not forget the loving TSA, which has been caught dealing drugs, hiring pedophiles, stealing tons of customer items, assaulting people, etc. You name it, theyve done it. This is basically an unsworn goon squad of Brown Shirts that Hitler had in place as his personal guard, before taking full power, and then killing most of them off and going with the more elite SS instead. This is also 1000000% unconstitutional as well, and goes against everything our founders fought against that the lovely bluebloods did to us for quite some time, before people had enough of it. I mean, hell, we have a president who has kill lists and does drone assassinations with no accountability at all and has killed American citizens without a single iota of due process. And of course, anyone studying the mechanics that oppressive systems to use to keep people chained up as sheep and their propaganda that goes with it, knows the whole 'catch the bad guys' is a farce and that the real bad guys are right under our noses. Of course, i can go on forever on that subject, as it goes deeper than you can imagine, and some of the things the US government has been a part of since WW2 ended, will make you want to vomit, but i digress. Let's just say, that 'Andy and Maybury' arent going to be coming back any time soon.

Enter Snake Plissken. A former military vet, special ops. Two purple hearts, served his country valiantly, but now has become public enemy #1, getting caught for robbing the Federal Reserve (in the first movie), which any economist with one live braincell knows, that this institution is purely parasitical, was never Federal and has no reserves. He seems to have abandoned his mission in Leningrad and took off to Canada. Seems our main character had an epiphany. He seems to realize that the very country he fought to protect, has now become the very enemy he once fought against. Snake alludes to this right away, when asked to save the President in the first movie, saying 'The president of WHAT?!' and 'I don't give a f--k about your president and your war.' So right away, we can clearly see that Snake, in short, is fed up. Fed up with the lies, propaganda and the blatant hypocrisy of the world he lives in. Snake reluctantly accepts his mission to rescue the president, duped into it of course, by nanotech he is injected with that will make his arteries pop open and he will bleed to death, with a timer of 24 hours. He is told the cassette the president has, has to do with Nuclear Fusion, and hes told it concerns the 'survival of the human race.' But it's safe to say, that Snake sees this technology as the annihilation of the human race. Im a proponent of Nuclear Tech. Its a wonderful thing and does have its advantages. But sadly, its been used to slaughter millions upon and millions of people, with many today in countries like Iraq, still suffering from the illegal use of DU (depleted uranium). To make a long story short, Snake eventually rescues the President and Escapes from NY, pun intended. But the final 5 minutes of the film, is where the treasure really lies, and where Carpenter, just like in They Live, has a way of using no dialogue, but letting the scene speak a thousand words. Snake doesnt want any reward. He simply just wants the President to tell him how he feels about those who died to make his rescue possible. The President responds with a generic response, as so many politicians do today, with the 'Yes, sure, their sacrifice will be appreciated by the nation.' However, the President did save Snake's life in the end, which is very ironic. I have to say, i never did expect that to play out in that way. However, its right at the end that speaks volumes. You see, Snake replaced the cassette, with Cabby's jazz and orchestral music, and when the President pushes the play button so the diplomats at this Summit he was supposed to attend could hear it, they are treated to an uplifting broadway-esque tune. The President said his tape would be something to bring 'peace'. Well, you see...THAT is what brings peace. Creativity, classical and artistic musical composition, drama, poetry, class, higher education, principled discoveries with the right moral objectives behind it, and all the great things accomplished in our culture through the Renaissance years. THAT IS WHAT BRINGS PEACE. THAT IS WHERE MANKIND'S MIND AND HEART NEED TO BE, not creating weapons of doom and destruction, which is why as the movie ends, Snake is walking away, with the American flag in the background, destroying the real cassette, and gives off a light-hearted smirk, as that classic and awesome theme begins to play. This is the message of the movie, and the message Carpenter is trying to get the viewers to see and understand. Mankind has the potential unlike any other species to build and forecast its own future. No other being can do this. Yet, we tend to go backward and are so destructive for the most part.

So, fast forward to 2013, in Escape from LA, and well, not much has changed and things have only gotten worse. Now, LA is a prison city, where the 'unwanted' of society are cast aside due to the state's self-professed measures taken on those it sees are unfit (in other words, mostly those who dared speak out and called out the government for its crimes and corruption). The President this time around, well, long story short, is a lunatic theocrat, using his zealotry to mask all of his repressive schemes. His daughter however, realizes what a monster he is, hijacks a plane with a 'black box' containing something 'top secret' and lands in the prison city now known as LA. Enter Snake, once again, used by the state to go in, retrieve the black box, and told that if he finds the daughter, to kill her. Jee, what a loving President, who couldnt care less about his daughter's own life. Then again, this really is another allusion to the diseased mind-set of politicians today, where life is rarely valued by many of them, only their greed and whatever keeps them in power. Snake is loaded up with what it is called Plutoxin 7, a genetically engineered virus (again, practically all of our food today in franken-garbage by the loving Monsanto, who lobbies and buys out the government to stop our food from being labeled, and whose goal it is to monopolize and feed us known toxins that are proven to be carcinogenic, but...who cares, right?) that is timed to kick in and kill him in 10 hours. Some will say this is redundant and just a remake of the 1st, and sure, much of it is, but honestly, this isnt a bad thing. After all, this is what Snake does best and with the tyranny taking place in the world he is part of, its only fitting this type of theme take place again.

There are some great actors in this film, one being Stacy Keach, who is always great in every role ive seen him in. He just has a great presence i always find enjoyable. Michelle Forbes, plays his 2nd officer, who has been in many TV shows and other films over the years, and a fine actress. Steve Buschemi of course, is always great and about as unique a personality as you can find out there, however, his role here seemed a bit unnecessary at times. I mean, look, i wont lie, some of the actions scenes in the movie were...well, bad. Again, this is something Carpenter doesnt focus on and some even feel he does this intentionally, as a way to throw in that comic book element (similar to a Kill Bill type of thing). Youll notice some of the scenes in the movie are animated or still-drawn backgrounds. Its a great touch, but here, some of the cominc-book hero scenes are way overdone and just silly and simply could have been gone about better and more believable. For example, Snake is on his motorcycle and being shot at pretty much point blank range by two others who fail to hit him, then slide off their bikes for no reason, and the bikes just explode (for no reason lol). Then right after this, he is being peppered from an uzi like 20 ft away from the truck in front, so he speeds up, jumps over that truck, lands in the truck ahead (which is totally superimposed as it comes into view lol), pulls out the shotgun held to the motorcycle and shoots the guy who was previously firing the uzi (now behind him). I mean, why didnt he just use the shotgun when he was behind him? Then you have the worst scene of all with Snake riding the tidal wave with a surfer who takes a liking to Snake, and he 'high fives' him, as he rides the wave and lands on Buschemi's car who was adjacent to him on the street, which was just extremely over-the-top and just poorly executed. Plus, Snake was shot in the leg at the time and also weakened from the nano-virus. These action sequences could have been thought out much better, which sadly, hurt the movie a lot and didnt allow those to grasp Carpenters overall message of the film. I didnt mind the basketball scene much, i thought that was just fine and pretty funny. I mean, hey, its Snake. He isnt supposed to die. He cant die and he has to accomplish certain things that no one else can, ya know?

One of my favorite scenes in the movie, and one that spoke to such great parallels of our world today, is with Snake and Tamisla (Valeria Golino, some will remember her from Rainman). She tells Snake she was put there for being a Muslim, which was criminalized after some time. Well, its safe to say thats pretty much happening today everywhere, in a sense pertaining to the demonization and attacks on Islam, but on Christianity as well. Its no secret the anti-muslim approach has been overwhelming today, with the ethnic profiling and illegal set ups of patsies that NYPD itself has been found guilty of, as well as all the attacks on Christians today, where advocacy groups working directly for the Pentagon, want Chaplains in the Army to refrain from proselytizing to troops, which of course, is everything being Chaplain is all about. They are removing crosses from bases, with all this politically correct garbage we see so much of. God or the word 'god' is removed from schools, prayers, the Pledge of Allegiance. We all remember the Tebow debacle, and how grad students cant 'thank Jesus' at ceremonies anymore. The list just goes on and on. Yet, the funny thing is that one of the police thugs in the beginning of the movie tells Snake how all the 'bad people, unwanted and the ATHEISTS', are thrown into LA. Well, see, this is more hypocrisy, we because all know who the real atheists truly were, because if they were moral and real Christians, including the lunatic President, they wouldnt be doing what they were doing in the movie. But this here, is a HUGE, and i mean, HUGE allusion to real life today.

He then asks Tamisla why she wont just leave and go south to MX or something. She says 'Why should i? We are more free here than out there. Out there is the real prison.' Pure gold there. She is right. Just how free were they before? Just how many rights did they have before? Well, now they can 'wear fur coats' as she says, or practice whatever faith they like, without any interference from the 'loving and benevolent government.'

But you see, Snake knows all of this. He knows how bad it is and he wants no part of it. This is why he said in the beginning of the movie, when told he would be granted 'freedom' by the President if he completed his mission, 'In America? Pfff...that died a long time ago.' Well, its sad to admit, but yes, quite a bit of freedom has truly died in the America we live in today, and that's a fact, jack.

Snake is also well known by many people. They all seem to have 'heard of him'. Do they like him? Some do. Do they dislike him? Yep, some do as well. Why, is anyone's guess. I would say some identify with his anti-gov and patriotic values, and his Robin Hood style of sorts, while others are jealous of him or think he is really a government agent, which, technically he is, but he is only doing so to save his own skin. So its a real 'rock and a hard place' issue for Snake. But be assured, Snake has no love for the state and its duplicitous, tyrannical cronies, as he tries killing both Keach's and Forbe's character early on, only to realize his weapons were first loaded with blanks.

In the first film, you may remember how Snake always said 'Call me Snake', when the government agents would call him 'Plissken'. You see, he didnt like them referring to him in a way that would show they are relating to him as his 'old self', or his 'citizen self'. He sees that as a way of relating to them, which he doesnt like nor wants to be a part of. This is contrasted so well at the end, when the great Lee Van Cleef says 'Snake, i have a deal for you. A job, you and i, we'd make a great team'. Here, Snake says 'Call me Plissken' and walks off. Here, Snake is once again detaching himself from these state minions, not wanting to be all 'buddy buddy' with them, as he hates what they stand for and what they are allowing to be perpetuated day after day....*Continued in next post*

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you lost me when you called anti-abortionists patriots

I no longer know who I am and I feel like the ghost of a total stranger.

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Rules of Attraction. Great quote ilikeswitchfoot. I also like Switchfoot.

"All that we see or seem is but a dream within a dream."

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Rules of Attraction. Great quote ilikeswitchfoot. I also like Switchfoot.


Haha kudos for getting the reference, that's probably one of my favorite scenes in the whole movie.

Switchfoot is great, though they are so much better live then on album. Like it's a completely different experience.

I no longer know who I am and I feel like the ghost of a total stranger.

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It truly is a travesty
A travesty of what..?

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It. Travesty can be a noun or a verb. That's my untravestied adjective opinion.

I see these posts referred to as being ten pages long. No way. Even if it was ten pages, does it really take people that long to read? It's kind of ironic that I say this on a movie forum, (it meaning that I assume some use movies as a way to get out of reading, yet find themselves in a forum where reading and writing is the only form of communication; complaining of wordiness and even subtitles at times). It is a very special word.

Everyone should practice reading. No bookcase should be full of tweets - it would look empty.

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I used my English degree to over-analyze a *beep* popcorn action flick! Read the full story here!


And I really really hoped I wouldn't die

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screw you

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I didn't read this, and not because I don't like to read, I read far more than I watch TV or movies, but because this starts off by talking down to me for not understanding a film with all the subtlety of "man getting hit by football."

It was a lousy remake of a classic 80's film. In that way alone it was way ahead of its time.

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Except the CGI, this film is really good !!

Last Movies: - CA vs IM Civil War: 5,5/10
- The Huntman: 6,5/10
- Batman v Superman: 9/10

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Agreed

However, I think the film had the subtlety of "a man getting hit by a sledge hammer..... twice"

And also, to be fair, credit where credit's due (I read all of the first post before lapsing into a coma). The OP spent all that time, so many key strokes..... and not once accidentally hitting the delete key. Impressive motor skills.

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Is this your thesis for college or what? Ain't no one gonna read that sh!t man.






My Vote history: http://www.imdb.com/user/ur1914996/ratings

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Talk about a huge wall of bad grammar and mostly unreadable gibberish. Fact facts, this film is one of the worst films ever made and is an insult to Escape from New York.

Only morons in denial think that this film has some form of deep meaning that only certain people can understand ROFL.

Also if you look at the profile of the clown who wrote this trash, he only ever did this one review, clearly one of the cast pretending to be a fan.

How can you spot a vegan or a feminist? You do not have to, they will tell you.

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