MovieChat Forums > Horizon: An American Saga - Chapter 1 (2024) Discussion > This Costner Guy Is Kind of Crazy

This Costner Guy Is Kind of Crazy

posted 3 days ago by roger1 (2784)
8 replies | jump to latest

..and I like him as a movie star and I like a lot of his movies.

But consider:

Back in the 80's, he was famously cast as "the guy who commits suicide"(for one flashback only) in The Big Chill, and director Lawrence Kasdan had to cut his scene. Two interesting things about that: (1) They HAD to cut the scene because everybody is always TALKING about this now-dead guy and SEEING him(played by an unknown) , he could never live up to the talk and (2) in the years since The Big Chill came out...Kevin Costner became a MUCH bigger star than all of the actors who DID star in The Big Chill.

So because Kasdan had to cut Costner out of The Big Chill in 1983, he did Costner a solid and gave him one of the four Western hero leads in Silverado(1985) and Costner was on his way. Kasdan's pal Steven Spielberg put Costner in a Spielberg-directed episode of Spielberg's "Amazing Stories."

The summer of 1987 REALLY put Costner on the map. In the same summer, he had the huge action hit The Untouchables and the solid "sex hit" No Way Out(with a great thriller plot, Gene Hackman as a co-lead and again, a truly sexual sex scene that established Costner "for the lady fans.)

Costner's script choices were mostly very good and very offbeat. He refused to do any sequels. And he got these hits in a row..(less one bomb, more on it later).

1988: Bull Durham (baseball movie)
1989: Field of Dreams (ANOTHER baseball movie)
1990: Dances With Wolves(Hit, Best Picture Oscar, Best Director Oscar for Costner)
1991: Robin Hood(miscast but didn't matter) in the summer; JFK in the fall.
1992: The Bodyguard

It was an incredible run , plus the Oscar wins for Dances With Wolves(Hitchcock never won Best Director; Costner won with his first film). The one flop in those years was "Revenge" but it came out in the Dances With Wolves year of 1990.

But then things started to "shift" for Costner.

The suggestion is that, with all that Oscar gold -- for a very LONG serious movie -- things started going to Costner's head. He had these overpriced, overlong flops:

Wyatt Earp(undercut by Tombstone -- and Costner didn't give nearly the screen time to HIS great Doc Holliday -- Dennis Quaid -- and Tombstone gave to ITS Doc Holliday -- Val Kilmer.

Waterworld(its good enough, if a bit too "Mad Maxy" but it went WAY over budget and schedule, a near "Heaven's Gate" of a studio disaster -- evidently done on purpose by the studio to fend off a sale OF the studio.)

The Postman -- evidently no redeeming qualities at all, overlong, a flop.

As happens in Hollywood, those three "flops" poisoned Kevin Costner's reputation and despite all his first hits -- he was "sent down" an unable to get the best material, for years.

After The Postman, Costner worked a lot, but rarely in major movies, rarely in big hits. He still did some good work from good scripts -- Open Range was a great Western, and he was in a good thriller with Big Chill alum William Hurt in the thriller "Mr. Brooks." He did little movies like "McFarland, USA" and "Draft Day." He couldn't bring back that superstar traction. He got old(if remaining quite good looking -- he'd been compared to Steve McQueen when he was young, now we got to see how Steve McQueen might have looked old -- McQueen died at 50.)

He did straight to streaming movies like "Let Him Go" and "The Highwayman."

As recently as 2017, Costner was "name" enough to provide solid support to Jessica Chastain in Aaron Sorkin's well written Molly's Game. But Costner was still "a past superstar coasting on his name in supporting roles."

And then came Yellowstone. It debuted in 2018. And though it was for a streamer you have to pay for (Paramount Plus), it was still "Kevin Costner stars in a TV series." Evidently Robert Redford had accepted the part but something went wrong and Costner got it. And newfound stardom. And newfound fans. And a big hit. And superstar pay again.

The first time Kevin Costner got married and divorced he said "I want to get married again, but I don't want to get divorced again." Unfortunately, he did both again and the divorce hit just as his Yellowstone stardom was peaking...and we all found out even if he'd been "second tier" since 2000..he was still very rich.

And then he quit Yellowstone.

So far so good but comes now...Horizon. Big screen . Four movies. Largely paid for by Costner himself and...

...what do you know? It MIGHT be the 90s all over again for Costner. He IS kind of crazy -- driven by his own private muse, about ready to take all his massive "second time around success" and to sacrifice it on the altar of overlong movies that people don't want to see. Wyatt Earp and The Postman all over again.

Maybe. But maybe not.

CONT

[–] blue1981 (6989) 3 days ago

No he's a veteran actor who's been in the business going on five decades. I'd say he was at his peak in the early 90s with Dances with Wolves & Robin Hood. I hope to go see Horizon in theaters this week.

[–] Keelai (32741) 3 days ago

Robin Hood was panned. Bodyguard, Field of Dreams, JFK and his peak film Dances with Wolves.

[–] maul (1540) 3 days ago

Panned or not, Robin Hood was enjoyable, as was Waterworld. Dances with Wolves is his masterpiece though - brilliant in every sense. Whatever mistakes he's made during his career he deserves a pass for having created that film.

[–] Keelai (32741) 3 days ago

Blue1981 was commenting on "peak" hit films.

I never watched those two films, but I saw the heavily panned A Perfect World which I enjoyed.

[–] maul (1540) 3 days ago

Right, Robin Hood might not be peak in terms of critical reception but it's within that timeframe when he was a big star. Think it was like the second highest grossing film of '91 next to T2.

But yeah, I like A Perfect World as well.

[–] Keelai (32741) 3 days ago

I'm surprised it made that much. I forgot that I saw it in the movie theater, too. I only remember Morgan Freeman - nothing else about it except critics panning it.

[–] roger1 (2784) 3 days ago

But clearly it demonstrates that Kevin Costner is one of our most inscrutable and oddball movie stars. "He does it his way." Once upon a time, he parlayed a sting of hits into decades of barely-there small films. This time, he's parlaying a hit TV series(which, I think, he seems to really think is a bit beneath him -- he's called it a soap opera and doesn't like the villainy of his character) into...The Postman?

We shall see.

PS. A claim to Costner's fame -- other than looking like a mix of McQueen and Gary Cooper in the beginning - is his willingness to play really ORNERY men. People seem to like that in their male movie stars. There is a moment in The Bodyguard where a pretty woman approaches him at a party and says "I've waited the whole evening to walk across this room and meet you " and he snarls "Well, why don't you walk all the way back?" I always used THAT line as a marker to his entire CAREER of surly , ornery guys in the 80s and early 90s'. He certainly brought it back as Jessica Chastain's "mean dad" in Molly's Game, and I guess he used it well on Yellowstone. Its his thing. Maybe in real life, too?

[–] AsBelowSoAbove (361) 3 days ago

Well Roger I like a lot of his films.. you left out some good stuff.. Untouchables, American Flyers, No Way Out, Revenge, Perfect World, Message in a Bottle, 13 days etc. but I have no reservations in calling him an arrogant ass that rises to the level of James Cameron. It usually shows up in his portrayal of characters as well. Hes his own biggest fan and must have a house full of his own pictures and awards placed EVERYWHERE.

Hes a good actor and a very solid director although never again to the level of Dances with Wolves. The rest of his self directed films I would say are OK. Not great but solid. He is extremely pretentious and can turn his films into "Masturbatory" (Carpenters term) works of vanity. Dont forget his music career either LOL.

Personally I just watch his films but Im not going to rush out and throw money at it. Ill check it out for free when its available. Could be 3-4 years. I can wait. Its not like hes Sergio Leone. I have lots of good westerns me and the kids can watch anytime we want. As a director I think hes overrated. Dances had a small impact but the rest came and went with basically no impact. All those awards from Dances With Wolves came to early in his career and probably would have been better later. He kind of lost his head. Happens to a lot of people in entertainment. Take someone like him as opposed to say Stallone with Rocky. Stallone got better. I also think Stallone is a better filmmaker.

As far as how he always was... Hes always kind of been an ass even in the roles he chose. Most of his characters are selfish jerkoffs which is not surprising. He does have ability though and as an actor anyways a major impact and screen presence. Not my favorite actor but he is in some of my favorite films. No Way Out is a forgotten gem. 13 Days is Excellent ...Bruce Greenwood is the standout in that film. Both are Roger Donaldson films who is just yet another forgotten Director thats underrated.