MovieChat Forums > Dunkirk (2017) Discussion > Anyone thinks the color grading looks of...

Anyone thinks the color grading looks off?


I can't quite put my finger on what I don't like about it, it's not terrible or anything but it just seems a little off to me. Maybe too much contrast or something.

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Could it be because it's from film, not digital?

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No that's not it, I just played the trailer side by side with the trailers for Saving Private Ryan and The Thin Red Line and both looked way better than Dunkirk (although each in their own way). I think it's primarily the faces, they're too orange... but also the cinematography as a whole looks pretty dull compared to the previously mentioned films; there's very little attention paid to the aesthetics of it all and it seems Nolan is just going for maximum image quality without thinking enough about the 'drama' of a shot. I think it's a common issue he has but with his previous movies being mostly in the crime/thriller genre it didn't bother me as much as it does with a war movie.

Compare these 2 shots from Dunkirk and The Thin Red Line for example: http://i65.tinypic.com/11kxo3k.jpg

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His face does look too strongly coloured there for realism, in my opinion, too. The vast majority of the soldiers there will have been very pasty white. But maybe that isn't to best effect for cinematic purposes. The other still you compare it too, would be completely unrealistic as well. Maybe that might be more appropriate for the Pacific, and re the light in that part of the world, but the Channel could never look remotely like that. It seems to me that the colour balance has been related to the water.

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Another example of 2 similar shots from Dunkirk and Saving Private Ryan: http://i68.tinypic.com/2mzdxdv.jpg

Saving Private Ryan's grittiness really makes Dunkirk look kind of instagram-ish

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I get what you're saying but, in truth, you can't always compare stills, as you're doing, just because the scene is similar. One doesn't know the context re the supposed weather conditions or even the time of day.

But I am personally conscious again of an issue that speaks to me from that still, as has been raised various times, and that is that uniforms all seem to look unrealistically new and that people and vehicles etc all seem to look too neat and clean.

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Re the clean look of the uniforms - the 8 months leading up to Germany attacking France are called "The Phoney War"

The Phoney War (French: Drôle de guerre; German: Sitzkrieg) was an eight-month period at the start of World War II, during which there were no major military land operations on the Western Front. It began with the declaration of war by the western Allies (the United Kingdom and France) against Nazi Germany on 3 September 1939, following the German invasion of Poland, and ended with the German attack on France and the Low Countries on 10 May 1940.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoney_War

Many of the soldiers Britain sent to France were young and inexperienced. Many at Dunkirk may have not yet seen battle (though those who made their way to Dunkirk from surrounding areas may have been in battles).

Nolan also noted:

“One of the key things you came across, reading first-hand accounts of Dunkirk, was how young and inexperienced these soldier were,” Nolan says. “It felt very important to me, especially for Fionn’s part, to find somebody very new.”


On average, the soldiers do look pretty clean at the start of evacuation. But it may be realistic.

Here are some actual 1940 Dunkirk soldiers:
http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-evacuation-of-the-british-expeditionary-force-from-dunkirk-northern-20611887.html

And some say the beach looks too clean, but in 1940 the beach did look clean:

http://c7.alamy.com/comp/DRCXEB/dunkirk-evacuation-wwii-DRCXEB.jpg

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Compare these 2 shots from Dunkirk and The Thin Red Line for example: http://i65.tinypic.com/11kxo3k.jpg


Dunkirk shot has green bias, Thin Red Line shot has purple bias - different movies - different aesthetics.

In any case, I doubt the colour is final yet. The film is likely still not finished.

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I agree with you on both points, bias and the non-finalized color. Both good points.

What the color bias/palette reminds me of most are WWII historical books that feature photographs of that specific era. Exactly what it is I'm not sure (photo stock, camera choice, etc.), but photographs of that time period have that same bias and general look/feel to them that the trailer seems to have. It feels possible to me that Nolan (being so detailed and research oriented) made a very specific choice to stylize Dunkirk to resemble that overall dynamic and aesthetic, whereas Spielberg went the other way and preferred to aim for ultra-realism. Nolan seems to be aiming for something more dream-like.

I'm not sure if film vs digital has really anything to do with it from the actual media standpoint. Like you, I also tend to ignore anything in a trailer other than the actual content (i.e. color, CGI, etc.) because like you said nothing is final until the actual film is released.

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but photographs of that time period have that same bias and general look/feel to them that the trailer seems to have.


I don't think so:
http://i.imgur.com/MDAKZs4.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/miCCUJa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/hWJVvB0.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kB04Ucq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/gQtRYkj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Fx0xLw5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Oj94C7a.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/bcYzTTK.jpg

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The photos you posted are of bright, sunny days, while the trailer/film is purposefully more accurate of the weather the troops actually encountered in Dunkirk. Some of them also look as if they're Asia or North Africa, completely different parts of the world.

All of the photography of the era I have in my books, specific to Dunkirk and the beach heads, looks completely different than your handpicked few.

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Well, something in Britain (so were some of the earlier ones), looks relatively overcast.

http://i.imgur.com/RBhqKv5.jpg

Sunset through clouds (not in Europe).

http://i.imgur.com/tp1RqFn.jpg

Maybe you are thinking German photographs (Agfacolor) that can look pretty strange (and have a bluish/greenish edge).

http://i.imgur.com/i9yFxm1.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Twh1xBC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vR5Wevu.jpg

Or a Finnish one (one of the better looking Agfacolors I've seen).

http://i.imgur.com/V8gwD9N.jpg

IMHO these don't look too much like the trailer either.

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Yep I noticed it too with the trailer. But maybe that's just the trailer, because the colors in the prologue (in IMAX) looked really beautiful and realistic.

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65mm film has more image and color quality than regular 35mm film. Also Nolan is going for more of a grand spectacle approach as opposed to Spielberg.

From Wikipedia:

To achieve a tone and quality that was true to the story as well as reflected the period in which it is set, Spielberg once again collaborated with cinematographer Janusz Kamiński, saying, "Early on, we both knew that we did not want this to look like a Technicolor extravaganza about World War II, but more like color newsreel footage from the 1940s, which is very desaturated and low-tech." Kamiński had the protective coating stripped from the camera lenses, making them closer to those used in the 1940s. He explains that "without the protective coating, the light goes in and starts bouncing around, which makes it slightly more diffused and a bit softer without being out of focus." The cinematographer completed the overall effect by putting the negative through bleach bypass, a process that reduces brightness and color saturation. The shutter timing was set to 90 or 45 degrees for many of the battle sequences, as opposed to the standard of 180-degree timing. Kamiński clarifies, "In this way, we attained a certain staccato in the actors' movements and a certain crispness in the explosions, which makes them slightly more realistic."

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I didn't see anything that was odd. Reminded me of Saving Private Ryan or Enemy at the Gates.

Whatever you are, be a good one.

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I think it's maybe because we're too used to seeing flat and uninteresting digital films whereas this is 65mm film and looks quite similar to Paul Thomas Anderson's The Master, if not deliberately underexposed for more "grittiness." Honestly the color saturation and contrast looks far better than most films I've seen lately. But nevertheless, it's also worth noting that trailers usually receive different color timing as opposed to the final product in order to create a unified "look."The final film will receive more specialized timing.

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Personally, I think the way it's been coloured is more in line with the way in which Nolan tells his stories and how he directs, his films have always been about core emotion and drama between characters rather than elements of violence.

Saving private Ryan went about the colour grading by desaturation to make it add to the grit and 'hopelessness' of the war they're charging into,

Dunkirk, I feel, makes its colours more vibrant to represent the hope of them trying to escape it.

Just my two cents, can't wait for the film either way :)

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Trailers are graded separately, and often don't reflect the look of the finished film.

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looks off? How can a colour grading look off? It's purely the directors creative choice. there is no correct way or wrong way.

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Some people lacks intellect to understand it, unfortunately.

Nolan, I love you forever!

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There is a massive amount of "fiddling" with colour these days compared to a decade or more ago.

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