Dog name


I Netflix'd this because I heard it influenced some scenes in Star Wars. Although that was evident, I came out really appreciating the film in its own right. It's pacing and plot were far better than many modern Hollywood films. I had one problem though: Was it common in 1940s Britain to name one's dog *beep* ? Perhaps the term is not such a pejorative in that place or at that time. I surmised that was the dog's name because it was a black dog. I can imagine several PC groups going apesh*t over this movie about this.

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This is such a fantastic story, It should be kept as close as possible to the truth. This includes Guy Gibsons' Dog name, which was also used as a code word during the raid. This is history, this is the way it was. Lets not try and judge them by standards of today, because that just wouldn't be fair. Very few practices, customs or attitudes from the past would stand up to todays standards.

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Very good point

-- I am a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar --

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This is the last time I reply to this subject lol

Last week I was at Scampton for the Open day and one of the other visitors said something about the movie whilst a few of us were looking at N*****s grave, I hope if this person ever reads this he doesn't mind me quoting him, he said

"Reguardless of what the dogs name is, we lost 53 men in that raid, surely the movie should concentrate on that, not on a bloody name."

I agree to be honest, if people are ofended by a word, one which at the time wasn't seen as the offensive term it so clearly is nowadays, then I don't know what to say to you. Don't see the movie if it bothers you that much, or put your fingers in your ears lol I don't know ;o) lol It's just a word, its people, that have made it into an insult (or a greeting if we go by some people). At the end of day people need to make up their minds, either it is offensive or it isn't.

I wonder whay Guy Gibson would say if he knew the trouble his pets name was causing :D lol
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
How do you expect to slay the huns with dust on your jump wings.

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I grew up in south U.S. in the 50' and 60's and that is the first thing I thought when I heard *bleep*. But it was immediately obvious that it was so named because it was a black dog (and a sweet one, too)and that there was nothing racial intended at all. He was just another great character in a great movie.

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As everyone seems to be wetting themselves over the dogs name lets put things in perspective. Changing the name or bleeping it out is to distort history because the dogs name, Niger (had to mis-spell or be censored) was also the code word for the successful breaching of the Möhne Dam or MöhneSee Dam in German (translated Möhne Lake Dam). If the dam was not breached the code word was Gonner. After breaching the Möhne Dam the remaining aircraft of the Möhne formation then flew on to the Eder Dam. The first two mines failed to breach the dam, but shortly before 2am, when the third Lancaster had attacked, Gibson signalled the code-word Dinghy, indicating success with the second part of the operation. Other aircraft attacked the Sorpe and Schwelme Dams but did not succeed in breaching them.

When I was living in Germany for most of the 1990's I visited the Möhne Dam. There is a plaque on the dam giving a brief history of its construction but interestingly enough no mention of the air raid on the dam.

More on the raid & the dogs name at the following sites. The last one is the site of the Royal Air Force.

http://www.dambusters.org.uk/about.htm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2007/08/28/ dl2803.xml

http://www.britmovie.co.uk/forums/latest-cinema-releases/4138-dam-bust ers-remake.html

http://www.raf.mod.uk/bombercommand/h617.html

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As for Germany not being subject to political correctness, I would note that it is against the law in Germany to possess the swastika symbol, against the law to give a Nazi salute and against the law to deny the Holocaust. While any individual who engages in any of those three activities is pond life, it isn't the role of the state to prohibit such things either.



"Someone has been tampering with Hank's memories."

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...I was just glancing at an aviation magazine; I forget which one at a local newsstand. They had a write up about the remake of "Dam Busters". One photo from the 1955 version showed Richard Todd (Guy Gibson) sitting in a directors chair next to the dog; also in a directors chair with N-word emblazoned on the back. The caption read something like will Gibson's dog keep his real name this time? Not a chance unless they want Al Sharpton and his supporters camped out in front of the US opening...In the State side version, I'm familiar with, of the 1955 film the mascot name was Trigger; it made sense as the name of a dog on a airbase and a code word, if unoriginal for a military operation. It wasn't until I watched a History Channel documentry on the real dam buster raid I learned about the offending dog name and code word...I wonder if the characters, in the new version, will be allowed to "smoke them if they've got them?" Will the Germans be called "people with which we have a disagreement" and will their flag be a diamond in the center instead of the swastika? When the bombers attack the dams will the Germans fire AA guns at them or throw walky talkies at them like in the last "ET" reedit? I hope they don't change the name to "Darn Busters", you know, so as not to offend the religous right.

Just remember: I was as good as any and better then most-Vincent Freeman in Gattaca

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DBloodnok, what might appear to be political correctness in Germany to an outsider i.e. to possess the swastika symbol or against the law to give a Nazi salute was forced on Germany by the victorious allies & was not initiated by the Germans. In Germany they call this Siegers Justiz (Victors Justice); the German mentality is inherently rightwing.

On a lighter note here is a Carling Black Label Beer advert from 1989 posted on you tube. It shows a guard on the dam intercepting the incoming bouncing bombs like a goalie on a football pitch--classic! The link is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKHc-U2FNHk

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They have had time to end it. Fining people for playing a tune is just ludicrous.

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Funny how most of the replies on this thread start by saying that the dog's name has nothing to do with racism, then argue that black people should 'go back where they came from'.

I.S. Oxford

"The books have nothing to say!"
-- Fahrenheit 451

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so here we are all this time later and it's still going.

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Best thread EVAH!!!

I have read only the first few pages which went from discussing a completely un-pc dogs name from the time of the war to ermmmm Muslims, the government, the red tabloids, the AMerican South, Roots and much more.

It is enterainment in a can!!!!

All these people going crazy on both sides and you know what?

No one gives a toss about what you think.

If they make a remake they will make several versions and they will show them to test audiences and then there will be loads of meetings and only THEN will they decide what to do.

All this bile is quite futile.



If you love Satan and are 100% proud of it copy this and make your signature!

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On itv4 now and actually using the dogs real name

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Racism is obviously alive and well among IMBD website users. I was even more sickened and appalled by the ignorance, racial bigotry, and ethnic insensitivity of most of those making comments than I was by the use of the
N-word in this film, which was itself quite inexcusable. But so typical of the mores and history of both England and the U.S. where war films portraying white war "heroes" use racial slurs while at the same time failing to acknowledge the tens of thousands of black men who gave their lives in defense of countries which enslaved their ancestors.

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Ironic then that you can use the freedoms that ALL those men and women died for, to sit comfortably in a chair decades later, defaming them Giorgio-39.

What have YOU done for freedom ?

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@mainboardmoderator
Well said Sir!!

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REALLY??? So what else is new in the history of mankind?

NM

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It's on BBC 1 now as I write and I'm pleased to see the orginal name is retained.

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the trouble with subjects such as this is they become all about the postee rather than the subject. far too few ppl are able to examine an issue on its own merits rather than to just place it in the context of their own biased paradigms and point scoring.

the dog was called *beep* in real life.

this alone justifies inclusion on historical accuracy.

furthermore the word itself was comparatively neutral (root negro, ie black) until america popularised it as an insult. this lineage should be reflected in interpretations of its use here.

effectively what we are doing in censoring its use is censoring a factual reality that is insignificant semantically to the storyline but is actually a relic of both the first film and the real story itself.

so many issues come into play that it becomes a stupid intractable argument.

lets look at them
1 reality in films
2 hijacking of british culture by american culture
3 the civil rights movement
4 the political ramifications of using a word banned in two languages because of its innocous nature in the one depicted during the time period.
5 the fact this film would be mainstream despite the killings involved if it werent for a word.

the bottom line here is that the ppl offended by this word have good reason to be.

what is also ignored is that ppl who maintain the words innocous nature in the context of the film also have reason to be offended as they are seeing a part of their history re edited.

i personally believe that with a proper understanding of the reason it is used it is in fact better to keep the word in. its use is more in keeping with a verbal chime coincidence in a foreign language film than a politically offensive example.

the word really was used to mean black (nigre) shortened here. it also reflected reality (in real life the dog was called *beep*) quite simply it had *beep* all to do with africans, american or otherwise.


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i know what i want to say but ...

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Seems quite simple to me, call the dog *beep* if people don't like it they shouldn't go to see the film.

Simples!

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-13727908

Stephen Fry, who is writing the screenplay for the remake has confirmed the dog will be renamed.

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Stephen Fry, who is writing the screenplay for the remake has confirmed the dog will be renamed.
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Aparrently the name has been changed from Nîgger to Digger

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Understandable, but pathetic!

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Oh FFS this is ridiculous. The Dog's name is NIG GER.

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