MovieChat Forums > Red Notice (2021) Discussion > The Validity of Gal Gadot Beating Up Two...

The Validity of Gal Gadot Beating Up Two Men

posted 3 years ago by ecarle (14979)
95 replies | jump to latest

In response to an OP that got deleted:

They are fantasy scenes...women evidently like to feel empowered and men rather enjoy the fantasy of getting beaten up by a woman (THAT happens in real life, yes?)

I haven't seen this fight, but I keep figuring that if these scenes are to be believed, we have to believe that the woman has such incredible, fully-trained skill that her kicks and martial arts moves work WITHOUT weight, mass and muscle being necessary. Use the men's size against them , flip them-- as in judo. Use submission moves that require little strength. The Rock might be too bulky and slow moving to fight back correctly; Reynolds not in the same training class, etc.

There was a movie back in the 80's called "Remo Williams: The Adventure Continues" which posited a tiny, fragile old Asian man (Joel Grey) being able to destroy younger more muscular opponents with a quick stab of his finger or flick of his hand. That was total fantasy, too. (And Gal Gadot is bigger and taller than THAT guy.)

My point is that these "little woman beats up big men" fight scenes ARE ridiculous, but they don't seem to be going away, so I just adjust my usual suspension of disbelief a little bit more. After all, James Bond always managed to outfight any man who came at him, regardless of size of the opponent."Nobody does it better" -- even if she is a girl.

[–] Reaperscout (583) 3 years ago

The trailers leave a lot of the fight out (mainly the first trailer did). Plus there is a plot twist at the end of the movie that explains everything about the fight and why Gal can/could take them on.

But just because you are big/tall and muscular doesn't mean you can easily win a fight. There is more to a fight than height and muscle. It comes down to skills/training along with using your brain. Also survivor mode can kick in too/play a factor.

But look at The Dark Knight Rises. Batman finally beat Bane because he used strategy, although he got a little lucky because the blades on his gauntlet messed with Bane's mask and Bane went berserk from all the pain he was feeling now that his mask wasn't giving him some painkiller. But Batman/Bruce fought smarter instead of going in "guns blazing" like he did in the first fight with Bane.

Also, I just watched A Christmas Story not too long ago (unless someone is reading this months or years later, but this comment was written during Christmas season 2021). Ralphie is a small kid and stuff while Farkus (the bully) is a lot taller and probably stronger. Ralphie beat the living heck out of Farkus. Farkus was more than likely weaker than he looked and didn't really know how to fight, although he had a height and weight advantage.

I never questioned Gal being able to take on two men, especially someone like The Rock. It's more than just muscle. There are other things to factor in. When I saw the trailer, I never questioned stuff. I know how separate real world and fiction as well.

[–] ExTechOp (2766) 3 years ago

Batman finally beat Bane because he used strategy, although he got a little lucky because the blades on his gauntlet messed with Bane's mask and Bane went berserk from all the pain he was feeling now that his mask wasn't giving him some painkiller

I don't think that was "lucky" - he'd figured out Bane needed his mask and deliberately disabled it

I think it's an intentional callback to "The Dark Knight" comic series, in which Batman beats the younger, stronger mutant leader by fighting him strategically instead of with brute force

And yeah, since it's already been spoiled in this thread, Gal keeps beating the Rock because they've actually been working together all along. She beats Ryan Reynolds by playing dirty and using a spear.

[–] Otter (24464) 3 years ago

There's a little scene in the Star Wars movie "Rogue One" that features a woman believably winning a fight with men. The heroine is under arrest and is being transported, and she escapes when she's taken out of the prisoner transport, she grabs a shovel or something and knocks her captors over, and runs the other way. By doing this, she used the element of surprise, and by using the shovel (or whatever) she used a weapon against superior physical force, she used something that kept her at enough physical distance from a stronger opponent that she couldn't be grabbed, and she uses the force of the weapon to increase the physical distance between her and a stronger opponent, and she runs like hell while he's knocked over.

No advanced martial arts or anything, just basic survival skills for those who aren't big or strong. Totally out of place in a Rock movie, of course, Rock movies are all about fantasy and not reality.

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

It is just feminist nonsense

[–] Reaperscout (583) 3 years ago

Have you even watched the movie? It's definitely NOT feminist nonsense.

MAJOR SPOILER ALERT

The Rock and Gal Gadot's characters are/were working together the whole time and I think are a couple/married. The Rock was holding back in the fight because he loved Gal Gadot. There is a quick flashback scene to the fight during the reveal and during the fight (which happened off-screen during the actual fight scene), The Rock says "I love you" to Gal and then Gal asks him if he's ready. Then she flips him over her shoulder and throws him to the ground. Ryan Reynolds doesn't really get to witness it because he is still recovering/distracted from something Gal did to him during the fight. And when The Rock and Gal Gadot are having the moment that is shown in the reveal, the camera is focusing on Ryan Reynolds and we are trying to watch him get back up or is lying on the floor in pain.

[–] DrRed (522) 3 years ago

And she did it all barefoot all the while glass cases were being shattered all over the floor. All they had to do to beat her was schiess den fenster.

[–] Reaperscout (583) 3 years ago

I guess you never saw the first Die Hard. Bruce Willis was barefoot for 85-90% of the movie. And he was more than likely stepping on all kinds of stuff throughout the movie. He actually did get his feet all cut up too during the third act from shattered glass. BUT HE STILL KEPT GOING. So are you saying it's okay for Bruce Willis to do it, but Gal Gadot can't? That's what it sounds like to me.

[–] cyguration (3893) 3 years ago

So are you saying it's okay for Bruce Willis to do it, but Gal Gadot can't? That's what it sounds like to me.

There's an entire scene of him dragging himself into a bathroom, painfully pulling glass shards out of the bottom of his feet while grimacing and in pain and then wrapping his feet up.

The audience is made well aware of the fact that him being barefoot took a SERIOUS toll on his pain threshold.

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Bringing up another implausible movie doesn't make this implausible movie any more believable. There were a lot of things in this movie that were fantasy.

Spoiler:

Pretty much every part of the prison escape. I mean nitric acid and glycerin are used to make it, but you need to add sulfuric acid or the glycerin will burn as soon as it hits the nitric acid... which of course is not used to wash cloths nor would you have pure nitric acid inside a metal container since it would have been reacting with the metal as soon as the acid was put in it.

Then you have the Nazi bunker where the gasoline inside the car is still able to power the car... I've seen cars where gas was only left in for 2 or 3 years and it was already past the point of working in the car. In the 70 years of the cars being there the gas would have long since turned to a gooey varnish like crude or even more solid lacquer like stuff, but in no way would the car have started.

And there are a lot of other fantasy bits too. This movie was supposed to be light hearted fantasy not something to pass mythbusters type scrutiny.

[–] sslssg (28483) 2 years ago

I don't think that most people commenting here actually watched the movie.

[–] papamihel (1580) 3 years ago

In the "Army of thieves" they found a solution to this problem. Natalie Emanuel's character used pistol grips and really wide swings.

[–] acidraindrop (3055) 2 years ago

That's what good movies do. I actually can't stand it when the scaling with characters in an action sequence don't actually make sense; I'm critical regardless if it's someone like Gal Gadot, or Bruce Willis.

One of the reasons why I liked Atomic Blonde. Charlize Theron is clearly physically disadvantaged during most of the fights, not to mention that the movie actually shows battle damage for people.

[–] Befus (494) 3 years ago

men rather enjoy the fantasy of getting beaten up by a woman

Maybe scrawny little femboys that live on a diet of Starbucks and tofu and are jealous of normal men who can carry their own weight. Normal men just laugh at that nonsense.

[–] TheGreatBambino (207) 2 years ago

I'm an accomplished powerlifter with a high intake of steak and eggs, and I would let her beat me up any time she wanted to.

[–] Saenzwa9 (463) 3 years ago

Gal Gadot can probably beat up a lot of men, but Rock certainly wouldn't be one of them

[–] kukuxu (5409) 2 years ago

That's unlikely. A standard woman at her physical peak has the upper-body strength of a 80 years old man. It's a huge gap. And Gal Gadot is not even a female boxer, she's just an actress.

[–] asom (6556) 2 years ago

I want to see a match between you and her.

I have a feeling she would kick your ass ...

[–] kukuxu (5409) 2 years ago

Highly unlikely. I'm just the standard average guy that goes 3 times a week or less to the Gym. But that's enough. The upper strength gap between men and women is huge, that's just biology, it's just how the real world works.

Religious people use to have problems when it comes to accept reality.

[–] asom (6556) 2 years ago

Not every match is based on pure strength. Would you beat her in a weightlifting context or armwrestling? Most likely.

But in a fight that's not the only thing that matters ...

[–] TheGreatBambino (207) 2 years ago

Some hard and fast strikes to the eyes, throat and groin, and she could possibly take the day.

[–] acidraindrop (3055) 2 years ago

I'd take that bet.

[–] jerryrip (57) 2 years ago

You do know that she's just an actress right? She's not actually Wonder Woman or any super heroine.

[–] asom (6556) 2 years ago

Of course. So?

You think you would kick her ass??

[–] FootOfDavros (6884) 3 years ago

As I said in that deleted thread, even FootOfDavros Jnr was rolling their eyes at the ludicrousness of that scene at the time.

I, on the other hand, having seen that played out so many times in modern films had just switched off to the nonsense of it all. However it transpires that all was not what it seemed in that scene anyway, so no reason to get all excited about it...

Btw I don't think that Bond comparison really stands - Bond was overpowered in a lot of films leading to his clichéd requirement to escape having been tied up somewhere or other.

[–] cyguration (3893) 3 years ago

I kind of wrote the movie off after seeing that scene in the trailer.

I mentioned in another thread about a similar topic that if this occurred once or twice or we saw it rarely in films, it would be fine. But this is the standard fare in practically EVERY action film these days, and it's not just eye-roll worthy it's embarrassing and completely out of place with any semblance of reality.

And before anyone says "But men fight multiple guys all the time in movies and no one complains!" and to that I say, it's based on real life scenarios of men fighting multiple men at one time.

Here are a few examples of guys fighting off (and winning) against multiple opponents in real life (the last one in the elevator is some John Wick-levels of bada$$ery):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHmMy40wcbE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4S8t3HCXHI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLVWQR5_KjU
https://youtu.be/9BShlPwPx20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCFNvsjMs2Y

[–] BeaSouth (2832) 3 years ago

Your point emphasized by these videos should really end this entire thread. I’m not sure there’s a professional female fighter that beats that amateur psycho with the hands in that elevator clip

[–] asom (6556) 2 years ago

That elevator clip is a different fight altogether. The guy used a moment of initial surprise to quickly disable 2 opponents and then the fight turned in few separate 1 vs 1 with the guy already having the upper hand from the first sucker punches ...

[–] cyguration (3893) 2 years ago

Interestingly enough, most multi-person fights where the attackers/defenders at least know how to throw a punch/kick almost always turn into single-file 1-vs-1 fights.

People like to make fun of Jean Claude and Chuck Norris for this, but in reality if there is a 1 vs multiple opponent situation and everyone knows how to fight, most times it turns into a 1-vs-1 scenario so that people don't crowd and mistakenly injure or damage one of their teammates.

It's not so much that Hollywood popularized one guy fighting multiple opponents one at a time, but in a real fight, unless everyone crowds the guy and pummels on him (which we oftentimes see in gang fights or where people have no clue how to fight and just swarm a guy) most times it turns into separate 1-vs-1 fights.

There's another clip I can't seem to find anymore of a guy fighting three other dudes outside a convenience store in a parking lot. All three dudes literally take turns fighting him one at a time and knocks each one of them out (the first knockout is absolutely brutal, as the attacker gets clipped on the chin and falls face first on the concrete, and then the guy who knocked him out runs and jump-stomps the back of his head and neck. Absolutely sick).

[–] moviechatterer (13551) 2 years ago

Here are a few examples of guys fighting off (and winning) against multiple opponents in real life

I havent watched the clips due to being at work , but i dont see how it helps your point
If one skilled guy can fight 3 other presumably less skilled guys ,
then one skilled woman can fight a less skilled man or two surely?

all you've proved with man vs many man clips is its not down to strength, or even number of fists available!

[–] cyguration (3893) 2 years ago

then one skilled woman can fight a less skilled man or two surely?

LOL no... just no. Here is a skilled woman against a LESSER skilled man:

https://www.the-sun.com/sport/3965425/mma-poland-video-female-fighter-beaten-man/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-9THCvAD_o

She got knocked the eff out.

Here's another match of a female servicewoman in the Army against a man in a boxing ring, same results:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRfCpQx_FDE&t=179s&ab_channel=Mathew

all you've proved with man vs many man clips is its not down to strength, or even number of fists available!

No, it's to prove that people have been fed 200% bullcrap from Hollywood about women being able to fight men.

There is no scenario where a 90lbs woman manhandles two 200lbs men. Ever. It doesn't happen. The only equalizer in that case is if she has a weapon, preferably something long range.

Even in scenarios where the woman COULD help, she doesn't, like in this scenario here:
https://youtu.be/2KRQGfYfAoU

And even highly trained female MMA fighters against men pretending to be women can't even win, like in this case here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCzn0am8vos

Or here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=remsCdsLLJM

Or here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbCID2Gtax0

And before you even say, "But muh special forces and SAS!" ha.... here is how well a female SAS fighter did against a male:
https://youtu.be/FB1Y03Unea8?t=208

And here is one of my favorites... 3 Swedish female police officers being manhandled by 1 refugee:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EWu-9uYKlw

Sorry bud, but it doesn't matter the scenario or training, physics still wins out. One punch from a man and a woman is basically out of commission. Her only hope is to never get touched, grabbed, or thrown. But in a real life fight there is no invisible Hollywood barrier preventing a larger assailant from grabbing, throwing, or hitting a woman, as evidenced in the clips above.

[–] BeaSouth (2832) 2 years ago

The cop one at the end was horrible. The male Good Samaritan gets the guy under control and the lady cop pulls him off like he’s done something wrong and the three women immediately lose control of the criminal again. Reminded me of this Sydney Australia police debacle where a heavy female cop gets her teeth straightened by a short little vagrant guy while her partner watches completely befuddled for several prolonged seconds before pepper spraying them both and doubling over in exhaustion having done basically nothing.
https://youtu.be/f0aLJzhJTfk

[–] cyguration (3893) 2 years ago

Wow I hadn't seen that video before, that is really horrible.

Just goes to show that a lot of people being fed this Hollywood nonsense is literally getting people hurt in bad ways... in real life.

It's one thing to include fantasy elements in films for entertainment purposes, but this whole propaganda push that "men and women are equal in all regards" has literally resulted in very dangerous precedents being set.

Unfortunately in clown world, there is no way out of this and the train is moving full steam ahead with no brakes.

[–] kukuxu (5409) 2 years ago

LOL no... just no. Here is a skilled woman against a LESSER skilled man:

https://www.the-sun.com/sport/3965425/mma-poland-video-female-fighter-beaten-man/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-9THCvAD_o

She got knocked the eff out.

And that's not all.

They have the same weight. Males have a higher base weight. And once they hit the gym, they build muscle mass twice as fast.
http://www.ukfitnesspersonaltraining.com/blog/how-much-muscle-mass-can-we-theoretically-gain

That means that the male in the video is not only lesser skilled than the female. He spends way less time exercising and doing strength-training too.